Michigan Votes Forum

Introduced in the Senate on May 21, 2003, to assess an annual $100 driver responsibility fee on individuals who accumulates seven or more points on their driving record within a two-year period. For each additional point above this amount an additional fee of $50 would be assessed. Higher fees would be assessed for certain very serious driving infractions, such as manslaughter, drunk driving, or fleeing police. In addition, a motorist who fails to produce his or her proof of insurance form when requested by a police officer would be assessed $300. The bill also would allow a person who has four or more points on their driving record, and who gets a ticket that would add three points and thereby trigger the new fines, the option to agree to undergo a driver improvement course. Completion of the course would cause the points to be waived, and the proposed new fines avoided. An individual would only be allowed to choose this option one time. This is one of many bills authorizing tax and fee increases proposed to close a gap between state spending and expected revenue

The vote was 37 in favor, 0 opposed and 1 not voting

(Senate Roll Call 165 at Senate Journal 53)

Click here to view bill details.

Make it additional $200 for teenagers receiving a any grade less than a C average. And Additional $500 for teenagers who get disciplinary suspensions of any kind.

Oh please! Yes I am a teacher-if anyone is listening please make it $1000 for any driving age high school student who has disciplinary suspensions on their records. The only way these students of today listen is if you take it out of their pocket books! Some students use profanity at me on a daily basis! and I am told to keep it in context "because we a an institution of caring" "We are an empathitic organization and the students just have a some simple growing up to do" is what my administrator told me! Fine them unruly students for poor academic progress also.
Thank you for your time
Have a great memorial day break

This is a bad bill, and you passed it. If someone is so dangerous on the road, that they accumulated 7 points, they should be off the road. This bill will end up killing or maiming innocent people, in my opinion.

Rediculous!
Do not pass this legislation.
Talk about pushing people into poverty.
Tickets and points and insurance costs and additional fees annualy as a result of overzealous police writing tickets and unreasonable assessments of fees.

4 points with one ticket and 7 points by chance is all it takes for you to reap this wrath of law.

Why cause excessive punishment upon the already punished.

Targeting teenagers would be best. There are some in that age group that do not respect authority or parents or anyone else. But they mysteriously have as much as $3000 to spend on stereo equipment.

This is just another attempt by government to take money from hard working citizens.. BAD IDEA!

Zero Points Here!

This is probably being pushed by Insurance Companies. Under the deception of "We Care about kids" or whatever. 4 million drivers times an average 400 dollars every six month is how much? Now generate an excuse to raise it to 600 every 6 for each driver will equal a nice bonus for regional vice presidents to fattan and spoil their wives and kids and buy big boats and fancy cars and 8000 sqaure foot houses! All so they can invest in factories to go to China. Make this law so insurances cannot be raised and watch it fizzle out.

What happens if they don't pay this?

Does the license get suspended?

Do we honestly believe that people that would get 7 points on their license in 2 years would be less likely or more likely to drive without a license?

Makes TOTAL sense...when you are in a state government facing a budget deficit.

Rep. Condino, having reserved the right to explain his nay vote, made the following statement:

"Mr. Speaker and members of the House:

I have voted no as to concurrence with Senate bill 509 for the same reasons I voted no when this bill came to the House earlier this year. I believe the bill is well intended and has meaningful public policy reasoning. However, I believe the bill has serious constitutional defects as written, which make it impossible for me to support. I believe the bill as written violates the equal protection clause of the Federal and State Constitutions and may even have due process violations which may well render the bill unconstitutional. For these reasons I have voted no."

Rep. Bieda, having reserved the right to explain his protest against the passage of the bill, made the following statement:

"Mr. Speaker and members of the House:

I voted no on Senate Bill 509 (H-6) because I am concerned about the dramatically increased fines, especially the provision requiring annual 'driver responsibility fees,' which strike me as particularly punitive and unfair."

Senator Leland, under his constitutional right of protest (Art. 4, Sec. 18), protested against concurring in the House Substitute and moved that the statement he made during the discussion of concurring in the House Substitute be printed as his reason for voting "no."

The motion prevailed.

Senator Leland's statement is as follows:

I'm going to vote "no" on this bill now, and I would hope that most of my colleagues would vote "no." I think what we're going to end up doing here is we're going to end up with a lot of drivers now who are going to be driving with no license. These folks who are going to be tagged with this fine are going to be hit twice. I think it's unfair. Some folks will have to drive for whatever their reasons are, and if they have to pay this additional money to restore or to keep their driver's license, they're going to end up driving on the streets with no driver's license. It is what it is.

Again, I think that it's unfortunate that we are passing a law that says that justice is for those who can afford to pay the price. I don't think that people who necessarily have bad driving records are driving worse than other folks. They're just stuck in a situation where they're helpless, they can't get out, and they don't know how to use the system or manipulate the system.

I think this is a bad bill. I tried to make it a better bill with my amendment. As I indicated, my amendment would have sent them to driving school as an option. The purpose of this bill is to make better drivers. We're not making better drivers in this bill by sticking it to them financially, and we're sticking it to the people who are on the low end of the scale, who are the folks who can least afford it. I think this is very unfortunate, and I'm sorry that my colleagues don't agree with me. Please vote "no" on this bill.

There are plenty of good drivers out there who have accumulated 7 points in 2 years as a fluke. There are also plenty of drivers out there who accumulate 7 points from minor infractions that don't even come close to warranting a revocation of a license.

While I appreciate the fact that a license is a privelege, I don't see how this law helps improve anything except he budget deficit... by taxing us more instead of trimming the pork.

And that teacher is an idiot. $1000 for disciplinary violations? My kid put blue streaks in her hair, got suspended for it, and now I'm supposed to pay $1000 to renew her license? Sure teachers are under paid and under respected but this one is not only overpaid, she's over employed.

Why do we let ourselves accept this "driving is a privilege, not a right" trap of the power-grabbing statist establishment? Who says it is not a right? Our system supposedly protects our right to pursue happiness, which means the right to earn a livelihood (among other things). Driving is a necessity to make a living in a modern society (notwithstanding the whines of the enviro-public transportation geeks). Therefore, driving is a right, not a privilege. Like any other right, if it is abused, it can be taken away, in the same way that felons give up the right to vote and the right to keep and bear arms. But let us no longer accept like sheep this "driving is a privilege" mantra of big government's defenders.

While I agree with spitfire's basic contention, it is a misconception that felons lose their right to vote. The only time they may not vote is when they are actually in jail. It is very sad to see so many people telling me "they can't vote" because of some silly consensual "crime" in their past.

THIS law is ridiculous--anyone who voted for it should be recalled or impeached. Here's what happened to one completely law-abiding motorist, and probably to all the rest of us:

"This is a heads up.....you no longer have the "month" of your tags
(registration) expiration to renew....they must be renewed on or before
the FIRST DAY of the MONTH they expire. (It's on the list below)

The Clerk handed me a little Xerox slip of paper that told me since I
didn't renew the tags on or before the 1st of Oct....I was being
charged $10.00 per tag late fees.

My comment was - this is really sneaky - The State should warn the
people the first year, then apply the fine the next year. I had no
knowledge of this fine, before I walked into the DMV. I had gotten a
request from the State to renew my tags by mail, and there was nothing
in that letter that implied there would be a fine. Didn't work, I got
fined $30.00. FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE: September 30, 2003 New Fees Target
Michigan Drivers

On October 1, new fees, fines and surcharges aimed at generating more
revenue, at the expense of Michigan motorists, goes into effect. Most
drivers don't realize the full extent of the penalties coming their way.

Public Act 165 has instituted new "Driver Responsibility Fees" which
amounts to raised fines and surcharges on traffic tickets. If you have
seven points on your drivers license, you will be paying $100 each year
for two years. And, you will be paying an additional $50 per point for
every point above seven. If you're stopped and you can't present proof
of insurance, you must pay a $300 fine, even if you later prove you do
have insurance. If you receive an Operating Under the Influence of
Liquor (OUIL), not only do you have to pay your fine, a new $40 surtax,
and license reinstatement fee, but you will also be getting a $1,000
bill each year for the next two years (courtesy of Governor Granholm and
Senator Gilbert).
This additional money will go to local governments and police, county
sheriffs, the State Police, the state General Fund and local fire
departments. This sets a dangerous precedent, as the agencies that issue
tickets will directly profit from them."

I'm curious about the violation of due process.

I've recently received this fee as a result of unable to produce proof of insurance (it was a new car, the dealer delivered it to me and did not deliver the faxed copy of insurance...so I was stuck).

Anyhow, I feel I've more than "paid my dues" when I paid my fines to the city of Berkley already...totalling almost $100! Which I felt was outrageous at the time. NOW I find I'm essentially being "tried" for the same crime twice.

What recourse do us citizens have against laws like this???

Basically nothing! That is unless we as people quit our jobs and become our own watchdogs watching over our representatives and senators.

Wait...perhaps that's the best thing to do. THEN they wouldn't receive their overbudgeted payrolls as there would be less tax that is being afforded by the people.

I was hit by this "fee" as a result of a no-proof of insurance (new car delivered to me by the dealer who neglected to include the copy of insurance faxed to him as well as the registration).

This is outrageous! I not only had to pay nearly $100 to the city of Berkely for the fine (no fees were assessed because I produced proof THE NEXT DAY). I believe I'm being tried twice for the same crime!

I certainly will do my best to make certain people know about this bill/law, who initiated it, and who voted in favor of it.

There better be a way for people already caught in this trap ($300 for No Proof of Insurance) to be forgiven this burden after the amendment SB1086 passes. I pay my insurance by autopay on a credit card & did not receive PROOF in mail. Stop the insanity. Thank God for Republican Senator Sanborn and the like.

As a Districts Court Adminsitrator told me "Since the imposed fees go directly to the States general fund and are imposed by the State and not the Secretary of State, this is a tax and therefore we have Taxation without representation. This law has yet to be challenged and needs to be. The intent of the law was to deter dangerous drivers and save lives. There is no distinction between drivers who have suspended licences because of bad driving and those who've had them suspended for other issues (ei. child support, unpaid fines). State will not handle the matter since it's a relative boon with estimates that it could generate $125 million* (* From the Detroit News). Please Post a follow up if you've been Taxed by this new law.

The legislative record is clear: "Safety" was just the skimpiest fig leaf held over this new tax. In the spring of 2003 the Senate declined to adopt fee and tax hikes requested by the governor, and lacked the will to cut government spending. This was offered as a substitute revenue source. Today, the game in Lansing is to add points to what previously were "no points" offenses - the better to push drivers over this bill's threshhold. (Enter the keywords "driver" and "points" on this site to view bills.)

I was assessed a $300 driver responsibility fee for being pulled over with an expired operators license. By the way, the license was expired by 2 days. So on top of paying $225 in tickets to keep my license , i now owe governor granholm $300 for getting those tickets. Getting tickets for getting tickets hmm. That's like telling someone who has done their time in county jail that they have to go to prison for being irresponsible enough to go to county jail in the first place. I've paid my dues, i don't see why i should be punished for doing so. I don't see how my expired operator's license was an immediate threat to anyone or how fining me for it after already ticketing me for it is going to make things any safer for anyone. I don't have a bad driving record. I'm a safe driver, and yet i'm punished under the umbrella of keeping others safe. This has little to do with safety, and everything to do with money. If governor Granholm wasn't so incompetant and could actually balance a budget, she wouldn't have to resort to extorting money from a college kid who can barely keep his wheels on the road as it is with insurance fees, repairs, etc.

That's what this is. Impose fees on people, remove their licenses to drive when they can't pay, remove their means to get to and from work, then tack another license reinstatement fee on for having the will to defy the mighty nation of Mi$higan

So they extort from us instead. That's all this is. SOOO many of the offenses listed in the driver responsibility act are like the most common offenses one could make when driving. They would have to be, because the number of drunk driver's is only going to go so far. So on top of relatively reasonable ticket fees, they tack disproportionately punitive fees on to those ticket fees. Being ticketed for being ticketed. nice.

Hire competant instructors. Send said teenagers to schools that don't spend more on the football programs than they do on fixing the leaky roofs (see Jefferson High School in monroe county). How old are you? 50? 60? 80? you'd have to be to be that out of touch with reality

Don't you need to change your depends?

of a Canadian liberal. Spend out of control, stick the populace with the tab.

who wants to bet they vote themselves raises with this new levy.

paying your dues to the county where the offense was made just to have the state decide they get a cut too. They're really overstepping their bounds with this one. Yeah, this bill might be good for safety if it only included penalties for those who drive drunk or commit vehicular manslaughter, but that doesn't happen frequently enough to fix the budget deficit. Hence all the other BS levies included under the guise of protecting all of us ignorant sheep.

Why are schools more preoccupied with policing their students instead of educating them lately? I agree this is a levy in disguise. Its ridiculous that you have to pay tickets, then pay tickets because you had to pay tickets. Not to mention the fines in the so called "Driver responsibility fee" are almost ALWAYS disproportionate in monetary value then the tickets that caused the fee to be applied in the first place. A no opps ticket runs $125 no problem grin and bear it but then to recieve a $300 for getting that $125 ticket, that's just ludicrous. I'd like to know why the driver responsibility fee is so disproportionate to the tickets that trigger its application, really, i would. Could it be that this is a tax in disguise? Could it?

I agree! This is completely unjust! I had a friend who recently got a DUI in another state, and MI send him a bill for $2000!! He already had to pay the fines and fulfill all the other requirements and penalties in the state where the violation occured, but MI wants a piece of the revenue too! To me it seems like double-jeopardy...

Jennifer Granholm and her scared to death lackeys in congress who let this stuff pass. They pass a law that forces people to pay a fine on top of a fine that you got because you dont have insurance. I DONT BELIEVE IN TAKING A HANDOUT...so I pay all my taxes and then because of all the JOBS our great governor has ran out of the state, I lose my job and cant afford insurance, it was a simple choice, FOOD for my family or Insurance, you pick. Then just as I was beginning to get back on my feet I get stoped while driving to work and have to pay 320.00 dollars (didnt even fight it just payed my fine) then I get this letter in the mail saying hey you know what sir, we want our cut now....OR we are going to suspend your liscence, GREAT IDEA THERE JENNIFER! Now Im have a suspeneded Liscence and wont be able to work, without risking another one of these taxes, because fact is I DONT HAVE THE MONEY TO PUT INSURANCE ON MY CAR PAY 320 bux in fines and then pay another 200 bux all in the same 30 day period, thats on top on my mortgage....I SWEAR YOUR A GENIUS, Like I said I wont take a handout call it pride or stupidity but I WORK for my money only to see this state take it all. This law does nothing to effect the very wealthy, TAXES and thats what this is, should effect everyone not just the poor who cant afford to pay them...ILL PAY MY INCOME TAXES BUT ALL THESE HIDDEN TAXES, disquised as LAWS, HAVE GOT TO GO!

this is a over taxing if the fines are payed the goverment doesn't have the right to impose more money doesn't that fall under double jeperdy clause if the goverment has to bleed us go fuck off

Jenny figures that with this stupid law she can reach into the taxpayers pockets once again. Once you pay your debt it should be done. Unfortunatly Jenny on the block has destroyed the Michiganistan economy so she needs to take more of OUR MONEY. I'm leaving this socialist paradise as soon as I can.

Is your shitty attitude is because mommy didn't change your diaper? 50-60-70 out of touch with reality? That's when real life begins. You haven't experienced reality yet. Reality starts after you leave home and Mummsy and Daddy are planted in the marble orchard and you no longer have mommy's apron or daddys wallet to cling to.

Do we have our panties all knotted up this morning? Get a grip. All these fees are illegal and charging for the same crime twice is unconstitutional. Try going out and rounding up someone that got out of jail last year and tell them that Jenny thinks that they need to do another year or two, this should be fun to watch.

You would realize that the laws and bills are written by the legislature. They can ignore what the governor suggests, as has been done REPEATEDLY in Michigan over the past four years. A balanced budget also comes from the legislator. A governor is an exectutive-- they execute the laws, as is sign them into being. Even if the executor does not agree with a bill (or any of the things attatched) and she vetoes it, that does not mean the bill will not become law. It only needs a majority vote to pass OVER A VETO. A smart executor knows how to pick his or her battles. So, blame Granholm all you want. Just remember who to vote for in the legislature, because THEY make more of a difference than the executor. It's THEIR wording in the bills, not Granholm's. Oh yeah, don't forget to blame the FEDERAL government for drastically cutting what funding it was GOING to send to the states.

And apparently they can also resort to name calling! For whatever good that does on a public board where most are "Anonymous"

are sick and should not be allowed near a child. Seek Help

how about just taking the keys away when junior makes less than a c. or taking the tires off of his car when he gets suspended? Must the state do everything for you?

don't quit your job, just spend an hour a day keeping track of what your government is up to. if everybody did that, the legislators wouldn't DARE do anything out of line. keep your friends close and your enemies closer.