“Take It Outside”

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

bugman — Sun, 22 Mar 2009 21:28:15 GMT

women already can choose what to do with her own body, but she does not 'own' the life of the person growing inside her. a life destroyed in favor of a lifestyle.

no, i cannot choose to smoke, a legal activity has been banned after hundreds of years. a right has been usurped. a freedom denied.

no, i cannot choose to ride helmetless. the state does not trust it's citizens.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

bugman — Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:51:55 GMT

it is not her body she is killing.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

gypsy — Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:29:25 GMT

A woman can choose what to do with her body, you can choose to smoke, and if the helmet mandate repeal passes, you can choose to be imprudent.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

bugman — Sun, 22 Mar 2009 20:04:58 GMT

yes, we can choose to kill unborn people. no, we cannot choose to smoke. nor can we choose to fore go wearing a helmet.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

gypsy — Sun, 22 Mar 2009 13:39:58 GMT

Yes.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

bugman — Sat, 21 Mar 2009 23:36:45 GMT

silence.

they do not have the freedom of choice. but they should.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

silence dogood — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:14:23 GMT

no, trueblue. the point of this thread is to find out whether or not you are for it or against it. if you read my posts, you know my thoughts on the subject, i'm interested in yours. the point of this thread is 'do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?' some believe they do not. some believe they should not. which are you?

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

TrueBlue — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 19:39:39 GMT

Isnt the point of this thread "Freedom of choice". ??

Are you FOR "freedom of choice" or against it ???

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

silence dogood — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 17:13:50 GMT

it's a simple question. a yes or no, one time, should suffice.your right to choose should not be 'conditional' except where it violates the law. choosing to kill an innocent is violating the law, and the rights of that innocent. it has nothing to do with 'a woman's choice', because the woman was not interested in choosing to control the birth, just killing the product of the sex. using a condom or saying no or taking birth control pills would be choosing to control birth. waiting over half a year while still pregnant says that she is premeditating murder.

defend it all you like, it is still murder.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

jmangan — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 14:10:32 GMT

uber-liberal:

so you are saying that you don't REALLY believe in freedom of choice.

You are saying I don't really believe in freedom of choice.

I am saying what I said. It is there for you, and anyone else, to read.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

uber-liberal — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:34:23 GMT

so, what does all that about no one having enough money to travel, therefore no one is free stuff have to do with freedom of choice?

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

uber-liberal — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:31:00 GMT

so you are saying that you don't REALLY believe in freedom of choice.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

jmangan — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 01:58:41 GMT

silence dogood:

it's a simple question, but it is at the root of so many of our debates on this thread, because it is at the root of so many pieces of legislation in this state.

the debate over abortion is, at it's root, whether or not the mother has the freedom to choose whether or not to kill the person growing inside of her. in which case, the freedom of choice is whether or not to commit murder.

the debate over smoking bans is, at the root, about whether or not a citizen has the right to choose to do something that others feel is bad for him.

the debate over motorcycle helmets is, at the root, basically the same question, whether a citizen has the right to choose what is not necessarily the best option in other people's eyes.

this takes the 'surface debate' away and gets to the root of the question.

i'm interested to hear your opinions.

Your debate is based on your premises, as you see them. That's fine if you want to debate yourself, but I don't agree with how you've framed the debate.

The question over abortion isn't about the freedom of the woman to murder a child, it's about the freedom of a woman to control her own body, and make her own reproductive decisions.

The debate about banning smoking in restaurants or workplaces isn't about taking the rights away from smokers, but protecting the rights of non-smokers.

The debate about repealing the helmet mandate you have right. It is about the freedom of an adult to make a stupid decision concerning his or her own health. It doesn't deny the rights of anyone else, nor endanger anyone else.

I'm pro-choice, because I wouldn't presume to make such a serious decision for a woman as to whether to have an abortion or not. Whether I think it is right or wrong, if it was me, my body, my life, I would feel it is my choice.

I'm pro banning smoking in restaurants and workplaces because smokers have many other opportunities to smoke without sharing their smoke with non-smokers, especially while they are eating or working.

I'm pro repealing the helmet ban because no one is hurt but the person choosing not to wear the helmet.

I realize this is very complicated for those who want a one answer fits all questions debate. Tough, life is complicated.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

TrueBlue — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 01:36:43 GMT

uber-liberal:

so, according to you, michigan citizens can't afford to make any choices, so they don't need them.

If thats what you have gotten out of all that, than you lack reading comprehension skills.

Way to go skippy You're living up to your reputation.

Re: do the citizens of michigan have the freedom of choice?

uber-liberal — Tue, 17 Mar 2009 01:31:52 GMT

i've hitched from virginia to washington state. from michigan to key west and back, and from dallas to dc several times. i've also gotten great deals on the internet on vegas packages. your point is moot. your opinion is invalid based on your lack of facts. your outlook is settled, and i don't think anything short of another election would change that.

so, according to you, michigan citizens can't afford to make any choices, so they don't need them.