Political Discussions

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

uber-liberal — Mon, 16 Mar 2009 19:33:47 GMT

i'll look into it.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

MrRights2BHeard — Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:29:05 GMT

Uber. I have a friend who just created a message board forum that features a wide choice of topics, and on that forum he welcome ideas for new thread topics. The site is Called News4Real Forum. Personally, I think that once the forum get to rolling it will be very interesting, due to the fact that one is a former Muslim, and William PaulX is still a member of the Muslim belief. Here is the url to the forum, and the forum welcome everyone who have an opinion, and other points of interest. http://news4realforumsite.smfforfree.com

Uber, I have been fighting againsted Corrupted Politicians since the mid 1970s, and yes corruption is at all Government levels. I am one of the News4Real Forum moderators (I was just appointed to be two days ago). So everyone please visit the Forum, and we talk about almostly all the issues that effects us in today's society. Again, membership is open to everyone.

Any problems reaching or registering let me know on here. Also, the Forum is making mentioned of this site MichiganVoting as a politically informed site here in Michigan.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

uber-liberal — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:45:58 GMT

i don't think you understand me clearly. how much money does the government really need to operate, state, local, or federal? how much unnecessary nonsense are we paying for? i'm not against paying taxes, but i am against paying taxes for non-essential services.

i too own businesses, and i know how taxes work. i am just not happy with the frivolous spending i am seeing at the local, state, and federal level.

it seems we need more like you. as soon, and very soon, our rights will mean nothing to those you are opposing.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

MrRights2BHeard — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:17:39 GMT

Uber, understand me clearly. Anyone who is in business MUST charge sales tax, and then that sales tax goes to the Government for business taxes. Businesses are paid by each consumer that buys they product, and unless they own the property that their business is on they MUST pay property taxes (here in Michigan its also known as land taxes). The Government can close a business down for not paying taxes, or tax invasion, and we must abide by the tax laws. I think that you are a bit confused by worrying about the Federal Gov, and our Local & State Government. I have 15 individuals on my Business payroll (employees). Its my responsiblity to do the payroll dedictions just before payday, but my accountist, office Secretary, and my payroll Director must make sure that everything is correct.

THEN, When its income tax time return each employee can receive so much of their earning back, and my business isn't like the BIG3 or Wall Street begging the Government for financial help. Now whatever I want my Local, County, State, or Federal Government to do I contact my Local, County, State, and Federal Representative with my concerns. Otherwise the Government has no need to dip off into my business. There is days that I do not come into the office to do anything, due to the fact that I am a Rights Activist against public officials who wants to play the game of Politrixs, and believe me I am one of THE best here in Michigan.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

uber-liberal — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 18:42:54 GMT

there is no guarantee that a business will be successful, but high taxes and governmental interference will guarantee that it will not be successful.

i don't cut and paste line by line, i simply hit the quote button and insert my comments in between the lines. having the other guy's words right there sometimes keeps one on track, but sometimes not.

i wonder why you think that business taxes must be paid to operate that business? aren't property taxes enough? aren't sales taxes enough? they will never be enough if our government spends frivolously. there are only a few things that government needs to do. the rest of the social engineering is not what the government needs to do. imagine the savings if government would stick to it's job and leave the rest of the programs alone.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

silence dogood — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 18:32:24 GMT

so, jman, you feel that dumping trillions of dollars of debt on the people to be progressive? you seem to forget that during the dustbowl days, over eighty percent of the people of some states and large cities were unemployed. if you didn't own a successful farm, you almost literally didn't have a job. we can thank the empire of japan for getting us out of that depression, from which, if they had not intervened by attacking us, we would very probably still be trying to divest ourselves of it.

bill clinton had the 'dot com' bubble, but he burst it prematurely by attempting to control and tax it. he also tried to put socialist controls and programs on the people in general, and they quit spending. this recession is more due to financial shenanigans in inflating housing costs than it is about government intervention. when a fifty thousand dollar house is selling for one hundred twenty five thousand, prices are artificially inflated. only the fact that prosperity allowed us to pay those prices for so long kept us from having this recession earlier.

let's get our government out of the economy and allow businesses and individuals make economic decisions for themselves. if our government believes in freedom as much as you believe in government, it should be easy to accomplish.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

MrRights2BHeard — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 18:26:17 GMT

[qoute=uber-liberal] as your government is about to find out on april 15th, it has a lot less tax money to deal with now than it thought it had. all because of leftist control over business causing business to go out of business. nothing can guarantee a business will be successful, but nothing guarantees that a business will be unsuccessful like government intervention and high taxes[/qoute]

All Due Respect Uber. I hope that you are the kind that can take suggestions? Whenever replying to a comment you do not have to cut & paste line after line from other peoples post, due to the fact that's why you have a reply button to reply to a post, and then under the quote you can type your reply. Quoting someone word is a waste of time, and then you (Yourself) will miss your own point.

There will never be a problem with people receiving income tax refunds, due to the fact that people will be receiving their own hard earn money that was taking out for taxes, and its a federal law that stated the rights to receive money back that was taken out of someones weekly paycheck.

Anyone who is business will operate their establishment from money that the Consumers will spend buying the items that the business have to offer, and bussiness taxes must be paid to operate that business.

Sure its true that nothing is a guarantee in the business world, but again businesses do survive from the consumers, and the Government isn't the one who decide who will be a success or unsuccessful. However, Your Government are the one who can say WE will raise more taxes to fight the war in the Middle East (not the Business profession).

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

jmangan — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:38:03 GMT

uber-liberal:
[in the 1890's, we had the gold standard, the government attempted to 'hoard' the gold for the first time. that caused a panic and destroyed the economy as it was then. in the 1920's we had our war debt pile up on us in our effort to control germany and rebuild france while we paid our soldiers for their service. we had another stock market crash, which was 'cured' by world war two. then we had the 'big problem' with the carter years, the dot com boom and bust, and this recent problem. i'd say that W had more high stock market time in his presidency than any other, clinton included. so tell me how trillions of dollars of debt is going to solve the problem we are in now? that's going to be obama's legacy. let's see him balance the budget and pay all those incentives he is dealing out.]

Rewriting history again.

Like most major financial downturns, the depression of the 1890s was preceded by a series of shocks that undermined public confidence and weakened the economy.

In the last days of the Harrison administration, the Reading Railroad, a major eastern line, went into receivership. That collapse was soon magnified by the failures of hundreds of banks and businesses dependent upon the Reading and other railroads. The stock market reacted with a dramatic plunge. Fearing further collapse, European investors pulled their funds from the United States, but depression soon gripped the other side of the Atlantic as well. An ongoing agricultural depression in the West and South deepened, spreading the misery to those regions.

Although thousands of businesses were ruined and more than four million were left unemployed, Cleveland did little. He believed, like most people of both major parties, that the business cycle was a natural occurrence and should not be tampered with by politicians.

That was Hoover's answer also to the economic devastation of the 30's, do nothing, this is all the normal business cycle. No matter people were starving and being made homeless, business must be left alone to recover. Roosevelt's policies didn't bring us out of the depression, that is true. But it saved millions from hunger and starving until the war finally provided the stimulus needed to jolt our economy.

Your right about W having a high stock market time. It's called a bubble, namely the housing bubble. As you may have noticed, it popped, and along with huge deficits from a war of choice, and tax cuts to his wealthy supporters, plunged us into our present near depression.

Only time will tell if our present leaders can pull us out of this depression. But the voters have once again gone to the bull pen with the score tied, bases loaded, two outs, in the top of the ninth, and chosen progressive government to pitch.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

uber-liberal — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 13:14:29 GMT

jmangan:

uber-liberal:
[yes, but simple complaining won't do it. we need to know what will make us better and what won't. the left has some wonderful sounding ideas that simply don't work unless everyone gives everything they make to 'mother government' to nanny the world. but most people don't want or need to be nannied, at least not for long.]

A grain of truth in a desert of deceipt. The left does have some wonderful ideas,

[what i said was that the left has some wonderful SOUNDING ideas that simply don't work unless everyone gives everything they make to 'mother government'.]

and it would behove us to try some of them, after a decade of trying the right's ideas, and seeing the calamity they have wrought.

[no, it wouldn't. we've had half a century of trying the left's ideas, their control or lack of control hasn't stopped them from trying to implement their agenda. their ideas simply don't work without massive taxation to pay for the social programs. some of us already pay half of what we earn to 'mother government'. how much more do you want? some of your vaunted european countries pay over 72% of everything they make, and it's still not enough.]

The idea of "mother government" is ludicrous.

[sorry, it's quite descriptive of how the left is trying to make it our protector, our nanny, our ruler. always under the pretext of doing what is right for us, but never really succeeding. the difference here is, mothers in the real world eventually let go.]

We are the government, it is what we make it.

[and the left has made it into the biggest boondoggle on the planet. always pushing it's agenda, always demanding more money. spending not like sailors, but like teenage girls at a mall with their father's credit cards, spending as much as possible as irresponsibly as possible as often as possible.]

To view it as an entity that stands apart from the people who created it is to deny our responsibility to make it work.

[we are trying to make it work. you are trying to make it support those the government has no business supporting using other people's money. let's try making government do the work of government, not the work of the social worker.]

Uber is right by saying we need to know what will make us better and what won't.

[some of us do, the left doesn't.]

We need to quit doing the same dumb things over again and again and getting the same results.

[like raising taxes, paying for unnecessary programs, electing inept politicians who bring us big government. stuff like that.]

Laiize faire capitolism was tried in the 1890's, it failed. It was tried in the 1920's, it failed. It was tried in the new century, it has already failed, and again brought us to the precipise. Each failure was remedied by the so-called left using the government to put us back on track with innovative measures. We are there again. The pendulum has swung to the left.

[in the 1890's, we had the gold standard, the government attempted to 'hoard' the gold for the first time. that caused a panic and destroyed the economy as it was then. in the 1920's we had our war debt pile up on us in our effort to control germany and rebuild france while we paid our soldiers for their service. we had another stock market crash, which was 'cured' by world war two. then we had the 'big problem' with the carter years, the dot com boom and bust, and this recent problem. i'd say that W had more high stock market time in his presidency than any other, clinton included. so tell me how trillions of dollars of debt is going to solve the problem we are in now? that's going to be obama's legacy. let's see him balance the budget and pay all those incentives he is dealing out.]

as your government is about to find out on april 15th, it has a lot less tax money to deal with now than it thought it had. all because of leftist control over business causing business to go out of business. nothing can guarantee a business will be successful, but nothing guarantees that a business will be unsuccessful like government intervention and high taxes.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

jmangan — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 12:35:39 GMT

uber-liberal:
[yes, but simple complaining won't do it. we need to know what will make us better and what won't. the left has some wonderful sounding ideas that simply don't work unless everyone gives everything they make to 'mother government' to nanny the world. but most people don't want or need to be nannied, at least not for long.]

A grain of truth in a desert of deceipt. The left does have some wonderful ideas, and it would behove us to try some of them, after a decade of trying the right's ideas, and seeing the calamity they have wrought.

The idea of "mother government" is ludicrous. We are the government, it is what we make it. To view it as an entity that stands apart from the people who created it is to deny our responsibility to make it work. Uber is right by saying we need to know what will make us better and what won't. We need to quit doing the same dumb things over again and again and getting the same results.

Laiize faire capitolism was tried in the 1890's, it failed. It was tried in the 1920's, it failed. It was tried in the new century, it has already failed, and again brought us to the precipise. Each failure was remedied by the so-called left using the government to put us back on track with innovative measures. We are there again. The pendulum has swung to the left.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

uber-liberal — Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:52:18 GMT

MrRights2BHeard:

Well, Uber, What about those who are in the middle?

[what about you? you need to determine what you believe in, liberty v. government, rights v. tyranny, and base your decisions on those beliefs.]

I am a Grassroot/Independent member, but my politicial background is fighting to better any giving situation, and to override the BS that ALL parties seem to create.

[it depends on what you call 'better'. to some, it is better to be a servant of a big government, to others, it is better to be a totally free man. i'd be interested to hear your definition of better.]

I got involved with the Revolution Movement by in the late 1960s (Old School). Back then Politicians was snakes in the politicial game, but the game was played in a different form, and now its all about getting over on the people.

[to some, it's always been about getting over the people. revolution comes in many forms, but again, your point of view depends on what you are revolting against.]

Do you all really understand exactly what the New World Order is about? Do you all understand that the NWO wants one Government rules?

[yes, i do understand about it, but i haven't found any 'purists in the movement', just 'fellow travellers, like communists and socialists. those who look to one big government to cure all their ills. it's hard to really see who is who sometimes, with all the 'conspiracy theorists' floating around, but i keep looking.]

Well to me its NOT unforturnate that politics is in a Ball of Confusion, due to the fact that everyone wants to be right, and NOBODY wants to be wrong.

[right gets elected, wrong doesn't. it's amazing how wrong the left has been proven, but it still get's enough votes from the 'gimmee' group to get elected.]

Can't you all see how the game of Politrixs is closing our Schools?

[yes, i can, but the 'fellow travellers' who elect those with the purse strings in government cannnot. and will not.]

Take a look at the BIG3 & Wall Street how the American tax payers are paying a wrongful debt, and we are knee deep into a War that do not concern us.

[we've been knee deep in debt since wall street was just a wall, and we seem to develop a habit of getting into wars that 'do not concern us' because people attack us. only this time the 'enemy' isn't as simple as the nation of japan, it's the concept of terrorism.]

Yet we continue to fall for the dumbshit that our Government Representatives are smearing in our faces.

[some of us, not all of us. some of us keep looking at the subject after the politician stops talking, delving deeper, wanting to know the truth. if you trust your politician exclusively, and believe that he or she is working strictly for your own good, then you relax. now is not the time to relax.]

We all can see how we are being harmed by our own people, and looking at the few who is on this forum that cares what about the other 4.2 billion citizens?

[the amazing thing about a free society is that everyone is free to take care of themselves. we don't have to always play neighborhood cop everywhere around the world, but if we want to have a finger on the pulse, boots on the ground, and an idea about what is happening, we need to be where trouble is.]

The greatest communications that we have is the word of mouth. With the word of mouth whatever we talk about concerning our own well being, and how our own Government is mistreating us can be talked to others as we go about our daily movement.

[yes, but simple complaining won't do it. we need to know what will make us better and what won't. the left has some wonderful sounding ideas that simply don't work unless everyone gives everything they make to 'mother government' to nanny the world. but most people don't want or need to be nannied, at least not for long.]

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

MrRights2BHeard — Sat, 14 Mar 2009 14:55:52 GMT

Well, Uber, What about those who are in the middle? I am a Grassroot/Independent member, but my politicial background is fighting to better any giving situation, and to override the BS that ALL parties seem to create. I got involved with the Revolution Movement by in the late 1960s (Old School). Back then Politicians was snakes in the politicial game, but the game was played in a different form, and now its all about getting over on the people. Do you all really understand exactly what the New World Order is about? Do you all understand that the NWO wants one Government rules? Well to me its NOT unforturnate that politics is in a Ball of Confusion, due to the fact that everyone wants to be right, and NOBODY wants to be wrong. Can't you all see how the game of Politrixs is closing our Schools? Take a look at the BIG3 & Wall Street how the American tax payers are paying a wrongful debt, and we are knee deep into a War that do not concern us. Yet we continue to fall for the dumbshit that our Government Representatives are smearing in our faces. We all can see how we are being harmed by our own people, and looking at the few who is on this forum that cares what about the other 4.2 billion citizens? The greatest communications that we have is the word of mouth. With the word of mouth whatever we talk about concerning our own well being, and how our own Government is mistreating us can be talked to others as we go about our daily movement.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

jmangan — Sat, 14 Mar 2009 11:45:51 GMT

uber-liberal:

i agree with you, mr. rights. but unfortunately, the left right doesn't. they keep on electing those who will harm us.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

uber-liberal — Sat, 14 Mar 2009 11:24:06 GMT

i agree with you, mr. rights. but unfortunately, the left doesn't. they keep on electing those who will harm us.

Re: Why Should Citizens Allow Our Elected Officials To Play the Politrix Game?

MrRights2BHeard — Sat, 14 Mar 2009 02:11:31 GMT

I cannot understand why we can't focus on these Damn Politicians who are crooks instead of focusing on each other. We are not the ones who are pimping the Citizens. So I suggest that we save our own asses instead of worrying about history. To me these online arguments is a waste of energy, due to the fact that we have more serious issues to discuss, and some of these issues are destorying our Families, making us lose our Homes, our Jobs, etc,etc,etc. Stop voting for these crooks who do not carry about yours & mine well-being.