Michigan Votes Forum

 no one has suggested the overthrow of government or revolution. as for your outrage being focused on reform, i don't see much chance of reform with the current government.

I felt the same way for eight years. I'm glad I was able to persevere.

 do you consider the current administration's plan of raising the debt by ten trillion dollars, surrendering in iraq, taxing at 15% of g.n.p. and nationalizing the banks is reform? or socialism?

The national debt is now over 11 trillion. Obama inherited that.

We are not surrendering in Iraq.

The tax rate as percentage of GDP, which is how it is measured, is 28.3% now.

We have not nationized, nor are there plans to, any banks. It has been suggested by some republicans though. Sen. Graham for one.

 our current president is planning on adding a ten trillion dollars to that. almost doubling the debt overnight. we are planning a 'pull-out' in iraq to bolster afghanistan. i'm talking about taxing to 10% of gross national product, not gross domestic product. and if you think that the current bailout has not changed ownership of the banks to the government, you need to watch your alphabet news. it has already happened on your current president's watch. which, of course means he gets an unconditional pass for it.

The president isn't planning on adding 10 trillion to the debt. The OMB, in their report, says the national debt could increase by 9.3 trillion in 10 years with Obama's budget. I'm worried about it yes, but a budget is a projection, as anyone in business knows. Conditions change. Stay tuned.

Do you not want to pull out of Iraq? At what point would you?

Gross domestic product (GDP) is defined as the "value of all final goods and services produced in a country in one year". On the other hand, Gross National Product (GNP) is defined as the "value of all (final) goods and services produced in a country in one year by the nationals, plus income earned by its citizens abroad, minus income earned by foreigners in the country". The key difference between the two is that GDP is the total output of a region, eg. France, and GNP is the total output of all nationals of a region, eg. French. GNP is less used than in the past, as many countries have many citizens working abroad. Because of this, GDP is becoming a more popular measure nowadays.

The government has bailed the banks out, and own large shares of them. That is not nationlizing them.

 how is the government owning 88% of a bank, and purchasing more not nationalization? that makes the government the majority stockholder in those banks. that makes government the boss of those banks. how is that not nationalization?

Nationalization would techinically be operating the banks. At this point, although the government may hold a majority of the outstanding stock of some of them, they are not operating them.

 nationalization is state owned banks, not necessarily state operated banks.