Michigan Votes Forum

to get pulled ove in michganistan is be young and have a nice car, an old car, or be out at midnight. We are a police state. Talk to some of the younger folks and you will be amazed at the power of these barney fifes that are running roughshod over the rights of citizens.

No he doesn't. Military officers are not above the law.

This supposed soldier will have to pay his debts, like anyone else. Otherwise, why would anyone ever giva any soldier credit. They cannot just refuse to pay their debts. A little reality please.

soldiers are the most debt ridden group in the country. they can't (by virtue of being 'out of country' do anything about their debt anyway. those 'in country' are spending like mad and borrowing against paychecks they may never see. anybody with any SMARTS doesn't lend money to the soldiers at all. those without any scruples lend the soldiers money at AMAZINGLY HIGH INTEREST RATES. that's why, at most posts, the first three buildings outside the main gate are a credit union, a bar, and a payday loan store. the pay is amazingly low in the first place, and those soldiers that choose to live 'off base' go into trememdous debt just furnishing the place. it only get's a little better if they get promoted.

just until they are discharged. ask the guys that get into bar fights the night before deployment, they will be 'taken in' the day they get back.

Soldiers have to pay their criminal fines like everyone else, whether their coommanding officers like it or not. As far as the high interest rates, thats a bunch of bull. Soldiers have individual credit ratings like everyone else, if they screw it up that's their fault. Also, no one has to join, so quit whining about the pay, free meals, and full health benefits. As far as those things you said were the first things off base-look again, they are all ON base. They are on the base because soldiers use them and the military allows it, either way, soldiers are not excused from paying for the crimes they commit.

JUST ALLOWED TO DEFER TILL THE GOVERNMENT IS THROUGH WITH THEM.

No, they don't have to wait. Especially considering the fact that some guys stay for twenty years. It's a nice myth though.

From the Post: [Payday lending is a problem not only for the soldiers, but for the mission of the military. As retired Navy captain Chalker W. Brown said in the New York Times article, “The last thing you want is a young sailor programming a Tomahawk missile in the Persian Gulf who is worrying about whether his car is being repossessed back home.”] Why would a guy worry about his car getting repossessed while he was deployed if lenders had to wait to get paid?

word IF? as in, I WOULDN'T WANT HIM WORRIED ABOUT "IF" HIS CAR WERE GOING TO BE REPOSESSED. obviously not. selective ignorance rears it's ugly head again. you don't know about it, so it can't exist. is this selective ignorance instilled since birth? it must be.

The if part was my commentary, you dumbass. The part in brackets was what was in the paper. You're right, ignorance does rear its ugly head.

What a moron. "Selective ignorance" indeed.

was too kind of a term. how about TERMINAL ignorance. there, that's better.

dumb-ass.

I had a DRF issued to me (actually the same month that this law started) I couldn’t afford to pay it so the State kept my tax refund for 2 years to pay it off. Well I got pulled over 5 days ago only to find out that my drivers license was suspended 2 stinkin years ago!!!! How can your driver’s license just get suspended and you don’t even know it?? I have been driving all this time in a brand new car - I have changed insurance companies (to get better rates) at least 4 times - renewed my plates 2 times AND even went to the Secretary of States office to sign for my daughter (as she was getting her permit) my question is how come no one knew that my license was suspended except for the police that pulled me over??? I am very ticked - I can’t believe that I have been driving my 2 children around for over 2 years not knowing that I didn’t even have a license??? Does anyone know if there is anything that I can do? It feels like the State has us all right where they want us - they suspend our license and we aren’t told so that we do get caught we can get fined even more!! Because if I was told my any insurance company or even at the Secretary of States office I would have paid my reinstatement fee and never been ticketed for driving on a suspended license!!! Now the vicious cycle starts ALL over again!!!! Michigan - What a JOKE!! No wonder people can’t wait to move out of here!

Get a grip, the State needs money.

give all YOUR MONEY to the state if you want to, but quit giving away MINE.

"Does anyone know if there is anything I can do (about the driver responsibility fee)?" You can pay. That's what you can do under existing law. And write Transportation Committee Chairman Hopgood of Taylor, asking why the bill to repeal these fees hasn't been taken up by his committee. Fleeing Michigan won't help. You won't be able to get a driver's license in another state until the State of Michigan says you're no longer under suspension here. And you can sue. The suits against this law under the "double jeopardy" argument were obviously weak, but I still suspect that a good lawyer might be able to make something of the following argument: The "driver responsibility fee" is unquestionably a mandatory fine for certain offenses. The Granholm administration pretends it's a fee for the privilege of having a driver license, but because Treasury is collecting the "fee" by any means available, a court is likely to agree that it's a fine in a thin disguise. Usually, when the legislature increases a penalty, it requires two bills: one to amend the statute that describes the offense (such as the Vehicle Code or the criminal code) and another to amend the Judicature Act, which contains the sentencing guidelines. Because all of the "responsibility fee" law in contained in the Vehicle Code, I wonder if the case could be made that these de facto fines weren't properly enacted? All I know about the law in this case is that some other laws have been invalidated because they weren't in the proper part of Michigan law. Perhaps a real lawyer can explain more. Most of the people victimized by these penalties won't have anywhere near the money to mount this case, which I'm sure the power structure is counting on. But wouldn't it be a hoot if the state had to forgive all the uncollected fines, and find the money to repay what it's collected so far?

let them go out and EARN it, like we did. THAT would be different.

You were notified of your suspension, so, you did know. It's all right to be upset about this law, but quit with the nonsense. You couldn't afford to pay, yet your income tax was kept? You didn't know your license was suspended? Please. Start reading your mail and paying your bills. I hope you do move away, the great state of Michigan doesn't need liars and scofflaws, such as your self. Good bye.

Terminal ignorance is reading an"if" into a newspaper article that wasn't there. It is also defending the fool who did it. Dumb-ass and moron, indeed.

You are, by breaking the law. Follow the rules and you won't be fined. This law was a good idea by the Republican legislature. One of the few.

your crazed! what do you know of this persons situation. Are you hiding outside their house? Digging thur their mail? Waiting for the moment to say ah-ha! SEE it's right here... Come on, who cares if they know their suspended or not- the law is obsured. To be doubled fined, then ontop of that having to pay 125 to reinstate your liscense. People are always roaming around on their high horses till something happens to them.. maybe you forgot to renew your tags or couldn't find your proof of insurence in time, than wham your hit with a DRF. Then your mad, then its an outrage that the state is fining you this money. I love michigan, you love michigan we all love michigan- what we don't love is paying out the eyes for silly fees and fines and the hassle that goes along with it. This law doesn't bring money to michigan, it brings angry voters. You cant file a hardship claim, you cant make payments its 200 bucks or your done. In a state that has an all-ready employment straped economy that just spells disaster. More people are driving around on suspensions, facing even more fines. Good wholesome church going people who just couldn't afford the 200.00 in the 30 day allotment. Are they bad people? No, sometimes stuff just happens. I would rather have someone on the street drving around who had expired tags then someone who still has a liscense but has had 10 speeding tickets.

you mean like the horror stories that the liberals post here about animals in traps??? or the pap that they post here about the death penalty??? or the outright lies they post about almost every other subject??? oh, no... you COULDN'T be talking about THAT kind of nonsense.

your probly one of the people who get to collect the money from the fee's or fines or tax or whatever u wanna call it or your a cop, and know what? i hate cops so you know why i hate cops ?? you cant trust them anymore because they have become nothing more than a revanue tool for the state like if you speed you will be fined if you j walk you will be fined , if your do anything wrong or "against the law" then you are fined, or you can have your home broken into and looted, and you call the cops ? you never see any of your stuff again. and its "we will keep our eyes open" also Please Explain why Michigan has More prisons/jails than any state in the WORLD ??? maby because they turn what one person which would be a stand up law abading citizen in any other state into a felon and the state of this state will only get worse as long as more people continue to leave because they wanna actually live in an american state not in this communist's haven, BTW dont pay the DRSF No one else is ? (seriously like way more then half the money is still owed to the state they have only collected like 26% or so of the drsf money owed) even if they suspend your licence is suspened drive anyways, michigan dose have alot of REAL Criminals and not alot of space to put them so... They cant put us all in jail for not paying the fee and driving on suspended licences, or can they.... NO i assure you they CAN'T Why?? because there are Too many violent offenders in michigan meaning they cant just let them out to make room for driving offenders and non payee's the only way they can is if they build alot more jails but then they cant do that if we dont pay the fee because their main income for the state right now is that fvcking driver responsibility fee (yes it is making more money for the state than the 6% sales tax, bet ya didnt 't know that did you ??)espicially because geting your licence suspened because of the FEE only Leads to another Fee and fines from the state so the cycle can continue, like if your late on a payment they will suspend your licence, and if u get a driving on suspended from that , you get another fee and more fines so all that money they are making adds up alot thats a pretty sneaky way to raise money its an awfull lot of money being made by somone in the government, and it aint me so this law has gotta go.

No it was a Retard law Haha just like retard who collect the money ticks me off we already pay taxes the state already gets enough of our money when they already have enough of what they need but the keep coming back for more money no matter how bad it will hurt somone else theres a nice warm place the consideate people who made this law should go ... i hope they burn in hell

... do not feed the TROLL

the troll, he's on a hunger strike, and want's to die of starvation.

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I think this law is crap. I got hit for driving with no insurance and 6 months after I paid city fines I received my driver responsibility fine. I had to pay $200 for 2 years in a row. I was upset I felt Michigan stole my money. Now I will tell you what I did, this will upset many people but I don’t care. First I sent politicians my plan. I paid my first $200 and let them know that I wanted my money back and wanted them to forget about the second $200, didn’t work. Now for action, I quit my great job and applied for welfare the next day I have not paid a single bill in a year Michigan taxes pay my bills, for food, and medical expenses. So far I estimated that I not only got every cent I paid Michigan but also my parents and grandparents taxes too. When I go to DSS I wear Armani and Versace, good thing welfare goes on your income and not your attitude. I don’t pay taxes I get earned income credit. So Grandholm, I gave you $400 you gave me about $14,000 was it worth it. Im sorry if this upsets people but Michigan stole my money and I raped the state

I too have been fined under the driver responsibilty law. $400.00 over two years for not being able to show proof of insurance. My wife had it in her purse. I paid my ticket by mail but did not know that I had to be present in court to show proof of insurance. It seems even if you have insurance you must show it in court before your court date and hopefully the court will send the proof to the Sec. of State. They must do this before sixty days or you still get fined. I HAVE STARTED A CAMPAIGN AGAINST TOURISM IN THIS STATE UNTIL THIS LAW IS REPEALED. I have successfully stopped a Marine Corps reunion from coming to Michigan in 2008. A loss of at least $300,000.00 in sales tax and money to local merchants. This campaign will continue untill this law is repealed. Don't just gripe about this law. It was made to collect money for our irresponsible politicians to spend. POLITICAL RESPONSIBILITY NOT DRIVER RESPONSIBILITY Start your own campaign and SAY NO TO MICHIGAN. Bruce at bobrykgomarines@aol.com

I feel bad that you had to do this but I know this law is hurting a lot of people. I got a $400.00 fine also. I too have hurt the State in lost revenue by undermining tourism and trying to block as much of it that I can. Try emailing everyone that you can and keep them from coming to Michigan. If they have plans to come here tell them about the possibilty of getting up to $2000.00 in fines. Have them cancel their reservations and let the management know why. When enough merchants get hurt they will let Lansing know and maybe this law will be repealed.

Dear NO WAY, I Sympathize with the person. I was pulled over in Grosse Pointe, Michigan while driving my wife's car for a minor offence and the nice officer gave me what was supposed to be a $35.00 ticket for no proof of insurance. He told me to mail in the ticket with my proof of insurance which is what I did. I found out later that you must appear in court before the court date and show the proof of insurance. It's the courts responsibility to send the Sec. of State the proof within 60 days or you get the $400.00 fine. I feel that I am a responsible driver and I feel I got ripped off. I didn't know about the driver responsibility law at that time. I know about it now and I wonder if the officer knew what he was doing by telling me to mail my money and proof in. Oh, by the way the ticket wasn't $35.00 as he said.

You are stuck paying these fines until this law is repealed. Sure Lansing will come up with another scam. Michigan is cash strapped. The only way to get it repealed is to get these wienies to realize that this law is going to cost the state money or cost the politicians their votes.

That would be great but don't expect it. I read that the State has sent out fines of $257,000,000.00 and collected $166,000,000.00. The idea of a good lawyer sounds great but I personally am fighting back by hurting Lansing in their pocket book. I started a campaign to stop as much tourism to our State that I can. I set my goal at $400,000,000.00 in lost tourism dollars. I started this a few weeks ago and have already got a 600 member Marine Corps reunion to cancel plans for a week long stay at the Soaring Eagle in MT. Pleasant. Michigan. I'm sending them a copy of my letter to the reunion committee that got them to change their mind. The letter was based solely on Michigan's Driver Responsibility Law and the possibility of getting a huge fine imposed under it. I hope that they forward it to someone in Lansing.

the driver responsibility fee can be considered a public service? i wonder if the state realizes that taking the peoples money by fraud and falsity is the mark of tyrants? let us take a hard look at who supports this bill, and make concerted efforts to assure that they, and any like them, never get elected to public office again. this state IS cash strapped, simply because it's guardians, the elected representitives, cannot spend within their means. liberal politics leads to liberal spending. liberal spending assumes unlimited funds. conservative politics leads to conservative spending. conservative spending assumes LIMITED funds. there are those that say that the state should be run more like a business. this is counter productive. the state should be run like a state. the business of a state is to provide police protection, not police harassment. the business of a state is to provide highways, not handouts. the business of a state is to privide education, not indoctrination. it is NOT the business of a state to provide subsidies to those who do not pay taxes. it is NOT the business of a state to provide decision making service on personal issues. it is NOT the business of a state to legislate "for my own good" but FOR THE PUBLIC GOOD. it is NOT the business of a state to DENY FREEDOMS, but to PROMOTE FREEDOM. it is NOT the business of a state to DENY OPPORTUNITIES, but to PROMOTE OPPORTUNITIES. it is NOT the business of a state to CONTROL THE PEOPLE, but to BE CONTROLLED BY THE PEOPLE. it's time for the state to get back to the business of being a state and get out of the business of trying to rule the people. all laws that are in place to "improve people" should be automatically repealed. all laws that are in place to bilk revenue from the people by fraud and falsity should be automatically repealed. all laws that are REDUNDANT should be automatically repealed. all politicians who PROMOTE AND PROPAGATE SUCH LAWS SHOULD BE VOTED OUT OF OFFICE.

who in their right minds would want to come to michigan for a convention? the prices are high. the hotels are few and far between. what hotels there are are taxed into almost non-existance. you have to make sure that any ceremony or ritual, such as parading the colors, conforms with local, county, and state regulations. you cannot raise a toast to such things as the marine corps birthday, or the corps itself, or duty, or honor, between certain hours, or on some days, at all. the freedoms we fight for are not here. the liberty we fight for is not here. why should we celebrate our beloved corps and the freedoms it fights for among those who would have us not be free? thanks for passing the word. semper-fi.

Freedom is something that this state is trying to do away with as quick as possible. I am forwarding your posts to some hunting friends in Ohio. Maybe we'll go out west this fall. It's only 10 guys but we leave a fair amount of cash every year.

I am a very responsible person with 2 kids that I take care of on my own with out the state's help and I live in a descent neighborhood. I was given fines and court fees and tickets to pay for and I sent my judge the letter stating that I had reinstated my DL. Come to find out, I did not know about a DRF until after it was too late. I was not given a notice of anything and happen to have been pulled over and found out the hard way. My DL was suspened and now I was getting a ticket for it and getting additional fees and costs. I am barely taking care of my kids and these fees I cannot afford. What is a mother to do??? Drive on a suspened DL or not work at all. The Bus can only take you so far and I live in Sterling Heights and work downtown Detroit. If there are any pettitions that needed to be signed or distributed count me in, this is unlawful and ridiculous. The rich getting richer and the poor getting railroaded and poorer. Please get a hold of me at elizabeth41281@yahoo.com THANK YOU!!!!

I really thank you for your comment because I am in that situation on what to do??? I can't afford to pay the fines and the DRF. I have been crying my eyes out because I am trying to keep my job but my DL is suspened. How do I go back and forth to work and take my kids to daycare? It is impossible. I am just praying that I don't get caught again because if I do the judge promised to give me 90 days in jail. Thank you for understanding, that made my day to know that someone understands. THANK YOU!!!!