Michigan Votes Forum

I am a mother and I pay child support for my two daughters. I cannot afford that amount and be able to afford my son and my bills. My daughters father lives with a women and gets his income, my child support, and his girlfriends income. While I have no food to feed my son. I have tried to prove this to the courts that my ex-boyfriend is lying about where he lives but the FOC will not listen to me. I am a nurse and make good money but I have to go to FIA today and see if I can get some assistance so that I can pay my bills and feed my son. I really think that the system is unfair. And where is my child support going my girls get their closes at goodwill. When I pay 700.00 a month....

There are Michigan Court Forms,scao,Child Support. Have to get prove,need payments lowered,receipts, prove your children need More TIME with you, thereby stating,more time with you,should mean less money you should give to supporting. Get more parent time

I have personally seen the devastation of divorce and by awarding one parent, most often the mother, sole custody, it allows her to be the "superior" parent. This is unfair and extremely biased!! What are the chances that after a divorce, parents get along? SLIM to NONE! and what better way to hurt your ex than by using the kids again him! And this comment if from a WOMAN!!!

THE COURT!!!! not the friend of the mother, not the friend of the father. THE FRIEND OF THE COURT. YES, THIS IS WRONG PLAIN AND SIMPLE. but, if this was all for the parents they wouldn't need all those people in the FOC. what would all those people do for jobs ??? the best thing for people to do is to draw up a agreement independant of the FOC. if you can eliminate the FOC you don't have to worry about losing you driver licence, don't have to pay those FEE"S that could be used for the children's clothes, shoes, etc. don't always think that ANY government agency is giong to make matters better for you. in most cases it only makes matters worse. do for your self, to much government in your life is NOT what you need. QUESTION YOUR GOVERNMENT...DAILY !!!!!!!!

are any of you from mason county or surrounding areas. And can any of you fathers get joint custody. We need to fight for this bill.

Correct you are and it is not just your county I was a single mother now married who has disagreed with Friend of the court for both wayne county and Montmorency County. Are you willing to fight for our rights please contact me Someone needs to stand up for the rights of all and end this mess my email is sheri_naidus@yahoo.com, me and my husband and exhusband are working on a solution with our lawyer all interested please contact me.

As I read the comments I cannot believe what I am reading. One reader states that our country depends on this change or we are going to be in trouble. We already are in trouble. These kids are so screwed up because of divorce and one parent is soooo absent from their lives and we have our wonderful FOC to thank. Where they get their name is beyond me . They are friend to noone they should be called Enemy of Dads. I will admit moms are sometime the target but 99% of the victims are dads and kids. These women get in front of these mediators and judges and create these huge stories that are usually false and these people actually believe these women. When you try to tell them the real story you are viewed as being someone who is just making up stories to cover things up. Well do I have a story for you'all. I met my husband 4 years ago and he has a 19 year old daughter and a 7 year old son. At the time his son Travis was 4. The first time I saw my stepson I was appalled at the care this child was being given. Here is a 4 year old with teeth rotten to the gum line, who weighed about a 1/2 what he should and talked like a 2 year old. I found out that not only did she control visitation but they were not going through the FOC for support either. His ex-girlfriend was one that rarely allowed my husband to see his son. I also found out that my husband was not only giving this childs mother 240.00 a month support in cash but was paying all her bills as well. My husband explained that he felt that if mom was happy and not under too much stress from money issues she would be better to the kids. I didn understand this concept and told him this is going to stop. A good mother doesnt need MONEY to be a good parent I told him to tell her to get a job like everyone else. This concept that a mother should stay at home and live on medicaid so they can be with their kids is ridiculous. I was a single mother for 9 years and worked and didnt get a dime of support. I NEVER used medicaid and I dont have a college degree. Once he stopped giving this woman over 1000.00 a month she started refusing visitation. We contacted the FOC in Montmorency County and thought for sure they would see the problem and fix this and do what is right. WRONG WRONG WRONG!!! These people are completely discriminatory against MEN. They gave us a caseworker that was horrible. She was extrelemly one sided and this woman thought this childs mother could do no wrong and believed everything that she told her. We decided that since this child is being so neglected , medically , physically and socially that we would ask for more visitation. Since the child was not in school we asked for 3 days a week. You would have thought that we tried to cut off their arms and legs. The childs mother was an alcoholic and used recreational drugs. We tried to tell the FOC mediator but she didnt even want to listen let alone investigate our claims. We decided to go to FIA and see if we could get help here surely we figured they would see this childs physical situation and react. WRONG WRONG WRONG!! We took the child to a physician and she filed a 3200 with FIA for neglect. This agency didnt even investigate this and it came from a very well known Pediatrician. It all comes down to 2 years of private investigation and court costs to get custody of this child which we finally got after 2 years of struggling with an agency that is clearly for the MOM. Now the child support is even more baffling. When this case was opened (by us) child support was given to mom for an astronomical amount of $487.oo a month for an income of only $34,000 a year. The friend of the court fought with my husband over deductions and things that are supposed to be included in his deduction BY LAW. He was treated like a dead beat and had never missed a payment to this woman EVER prior to the FOC stepping in. She lied and told them we never paid her anything. Fortunately my husband always gave her moneyorders which we had receipts for . We were then informed that we should have never paid her directly prior to the order becoming final which took 4 months, because all the money he had paid here was considered a GIFT can you believe that a GIFT. These people are criminals and should be put in jail. !!!!! DISCRIMINATION- After we received custody of my stepson in November of 2005 we finally got the child turned over to us in feb of 2006. They did a support evaluation on his mother and she was ordered to pay $40.00 a month. I was furious. How can this be. After a judge finds she is unfit to be a parent and this woman was proved to do drugs and was sited for neglect they imputed her income at $5.85 and hour. It took until September 25 of 2007 to get a suppport order in place. To this day we have not received a dime. Almost 2 years with no support from this woman. If this was a man he would be in jail. We still have not received a dime. Me and my husband are seeking legal advise about this and would like to hear from other perspective clients with similar situations. If you have a similar story please email me with your story at sheri_naidus@yahoo.com LET' DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS!!!! THIS IS WRONG WRONG WRONG

Your comment is so true, why arent parents given equal time. Kids need their dads. I have seen so many women get custody also who shouldnt and the court doesnt want to see the proof. I have a letter from foc stating visitatin was given based on other cases similar to ours. Not given based on the best interest of OUR child which is what the law reads. Who is accountable for these errors? I am trying to get this changed someone needs to be accountable for this who should it be. Our kids need EQUAL time with both parents.

My husbands ex was the same way being cruel to the point of simple things. She lived 1 1/2 hours away and by my father - in - law. If we were visiting we would call the day before and ask for a couple of hours visitation and the answer was always no. She always had a lame excuse. They wanted to eat dinner together or she already had plans or he was sick. We even contacted her around the holidays and asked for some extra time for a family X-mas party again it was no. We asked to have him for a couple of hours a COUPLE OF HOURS because we had family visiting from Germany and you think she would agree HELL NO!!! Power is always placed in these womens hands and make men feel like ants being squashed. Women wonder why men want pre-nups go figure.

This is absurd, You take a man and woman you send a man to work and have a mother that stays home and takes care of the kids the appointments the house and then divorce and just because your husband has to gain some new knowledge your sayinghe is unfit and unequal. KIDS NEED BOTH PARENTS EQUALLY. Your crazy if you dont think this is a posative thing people like you are probably receiving a lOT of child support god forbid you have to give up your income so your kids can see their dad.

your post to the prove it lady is right on . I would say she wants that almighty dollar, god forbid she would have to go get a job and support herself and her kids. I was also a 70's child victim of the 4 DAYS A MONTH , let me say that again 4 DAYS A MONTH, that is ludacris , You can have stability and schedules with joint custody and the kids WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I think women are going to fights against this bill because they will be losing their nest egg. It has nothing to do with their kids. Men dont pay child support because the court system makes it impossible to afford the payments incomes are inflated and the womans income is deducted. go figure

Dear Not Strong enough I am married to a man who has a very very similar story. I think this is criminal and someone should be held accountable. I am currently working on legal action please contact me sheri_naidus@yahoo.com

I am watching this Bill closely. This would be a great success for all children in the state of Michigan. Children deserve the chance to know both their parents, good and bad. How did a great nation such as America allow itself to get to where taking a child out of the lives of their parents was thought to be a good thing for the child? Where is the "Best Interest for the Child" in that thought?

I believe in equal parenting!!!! However I do not believe that it is fair for a child or children to be bounced from parent to parent week by week. We are creating a unstable living arrangement. And then If the parents don't get along and hate eachother they can feed their children with negativity about the other parent. There has to be a better way than every other week. Are we looking out for the parents best interest or the childs.

I believe that their should be equal parenting if the mother or father deserve it. Who has been raising the child. I do not believe that joint custody should be granted just because this is your child or children. It takes alot more than that to be a good stable parent. Also I do not believe that a parent who has been absent by choice should get rights just because he/she decided one day that they wanted to see their child or have a relationship with them. IT should be up to the child at this point. Or if one of the spouses is abusive infront of the children why do they deserve joint custody. but its happening.

I agree. The system needs re vamped. Starting with the affidavit of parentage form given to un wed parents. The second or third line states that the mother has custody unless written otherwise. Overwhelmed with all the literature and pamphlets of warnings and recommendations on new borns, mix in raw emotions of first time father hood, one definitely feels pressured to sign this form. After all this is your new child. Who wants to take this to a lawyer for a recommendation or explanation of this simple little “you are the father” form. I later found out how big of a mistake I made by not investigating it further. That line as mentioned above had a longer, life changing reach then I could ever imagine. After the fact, broken up relationship and my baby was gone. Many calls to “friend to other than myself” and they cannot tell me how the system works. I was told if I didn’t have a case then to get a lawyer and start one and maybe then they could answer my question on how the system works. Well we went through the rigors of figuring out how much I was going to pay first thing. Then how little I would see my child was second. Now I know how the “system” works”. My lawyer told me that had I crossed off the words “has custody” and wrote 50/50 and we both initial it, that was written otherwise. I hope this bill gets passed so no one else has to experience this terrible experience I am enduring.

If a parent is abusive or absent and then shows up - that is just unfit. Why should they have strong rights!

to those who saying having the kids bouncing from parent to parent isn't in the best interest of thie kids. The fact is, kids brought up in a single parent environment are far more likely to wind up involved in a teen pregnancy, in jail, or hooked on drugs. Is that what you view as "in the kids best interest?

The FOC is no friend of mine either. Ionia County FOC has determined, my ex doesn't owe back child support, and for no other reason that the teenagers want to, HE gets full custody and $650 a month! I think children need BOTH parents. Exclusive to when the parents are abusive, etc.

My husband is trying to get joint physical custody of his children from his previous marriage. The ex is a good mom and he is a great dad. They live 5 min away from eachother. Does anyone know what his chances are of the courts ordering him joint physical custody?? This is in WAYNE COUNTY. Is it worth going through the evaluation process and involving the kids in this mess?

I am tired of hearing that all single parents raise kids who are most likely to be on drugs, become a parent very early in life,Lets reflect on the successful parents for example in the NFL how may of those players were raised by single moms and look where they are today, let look at the base ball players out there get off the hook that single parents raise troubled kids. If the other parent were a more positive atribute in the childs life and was not on drugs or in jail, and paid support,it might make a difference in the childs life on where they live or even how they live.

I am the father of 2 daughters. My ex wifehas custody of my kids and i am disabled. the foc in van buren county tried to throw me in jail more than 2 times and now that i have a small amount of income I pay my support. I never missed a payment when i was working. My ex wife calls constantly and harasses me about getting a joba job telling me to quit being lazy, even though my doctor at the va hospital in Battle creek says i am going to be in a wheelchair soon. I have tried to call the cops but they say call the Friend of the What? I tell the FOC but all they do is laugh. We dads need to get together on this and any mothers that want to join in and fight the state on these. I called the state cicil rights office and was told basically the FOC is beyond the law. We live in a free country and this is allowed to happen???????????????

The best interest of the children should be the most important factor, period whether mother or father or both. Cases should be based individuals factors of a case, with the best interest of the child/children involved. My children are and have been stuck in the middle of madness every since I left their father a year ago, I have tried over and over again to co-parent with their father, put our children first, people talk about moms trying use children, oh it is not exclusive to woman, not in our case, I tried for months to get my children's father (mind you who was a wonderful father, very loving and involved, until I broke off our engagement) to go to court so we could file joint custody, I've tried to give this man joint custody, because it's not about money for me, what matters most is our children's emotional well being and development, I would keep him posted and updated on any event or activity they were having so he could feel and understand that he is still and will always be an important factor for our children, and that they need him also. So please tell me what do you do when the other parent doesn't want focus on the children, but only focus on the relationship between you and him that is over and now only consist of working together for our children. What do you do when the father takes his anger at you out on the children emotionally, I finally went to friend of the court (I didn't want too at all, I prayed that we could move forward as adults and parents) but once I did that to resolve custody, things have gotten worse, this man actually went a filed a PPO against me 2 days after we went to our custody hearing, mind you I very rarely talked to him or seen him, and the only conversation I've had with him is about our children and God (also the judge through the PPO out because there were no grounds for it, he wouldn't even show up and the judge felt it was pay back for going to court). I've lost my jobn because of their father, I've begged the courts to require him to get counseling, the visitation they awarded him, I've tried to get him more involved, but the more time goes by, and he refuses too get counseling or even just make it about our children, it's so much I don't think I have enough space to say everything, but my point The Best Interest of the Child/Children should be the only factor because parents whether mother or father, can't focus on that sometimes and the kids get emotionally abused and stuck in the middle. Anyone can have kids, that doesn't make them parents however.

I am a single parent, and I believe that if her father paid child support,and wanted to infact be involved with her life than okay but what about all the parents that stick their kids in the middle????? And they don't want to pay child support sooo they go for joint custody. OR HOW ABOUT THIS WHEN IS THE KID GOING TO BEABLE TO SPEND QUALITY time with either parent when they have to work leaving the kid to spend most of their time with their teachers, or a babysitter IS THAT FAIR???????????????

Its about how you raise your child you raise them with morals, and strength. You give them consistancy yeah it's hard but you do it because when you become a parent single or not that is your obligation. If you dont do that than you are failing your child IT DOES NOT MATTER WHETHER YOU ARE DOING IT ALONE OR WITH SOMEONE ELSE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

is not focused on the children. My daughters and I have been having the dubious distinction and disgusting past few months of battling with them over custody/pedophelia. Custody that should not even be question, can be twisted by low level low thinking money focused fems inside their little building while hiding in their cubes. Its a sad world sometimes. Those that ARE focused on the cash cow business they operate, should be terminated asap for disregarding what is best for children. DOES ANYONE think two girls, ages 9 and 11, should be forced to live with a convicted pedophile who is on the National Sex Offenders List for having s-- with his then 11 year old stepdaughter a few years ago, just because he married DADS ex wife two months ago?? please stand up and reply!!! Oakland County Friend of the Court Judge HALLMARK will be answering this question (finally) this wednesday 10-31-07, they have tried to postpone and hide and postpone and continue thier weak brained agendas for two years now. She may try to postpone. She may stand up. She may call in sick (but i doubt it), She may continue with her team at the FRIEND of the COURT and be anti DAD anti LOGIC. Please post your thoughts, this is LIVE this coming WEDNESDAY in PONTIAC at 1200 Telegraph Rd! thank you for reading! A Pedophile for Christs Sakes, is better than DAD??? Mom is an admitted alcoholic!! its beyond reason, other than DAD pays child support....speak up people!!

I believe in joint custody to a point i believe that fathers let me say this again DADS need more rights than every other weekend IT IS JUST REALLY SAD THAT PARENTS BRING CHILDREN INTO THE WORLD AND IF THEY GET A DIVORCE never look past their anger and decide "well we cant be married but we love our child(ren) So lets work together for them" ITS NOT A PERFECT WORLD AND I DONT NECCESSAREILY BELIEVE THAT JOINT CUSTODY IS THE MIRACLE however Like i said before fathers do need and deserve more rights

In the case of a divorcing family, each parent and their respective families should have an equal amount of time to share their lives, heritage, traditions, values, beliefs, and love with their children. No court, or government, should ever be able to abitrarily assign custody based on the subjective "Best Interest of the Child guide lines". Fathers deserve more respect, and its about time there is a real Equal Rights Amendment that addresses equality for both men, women and their children.

If both parents are already fit and the law was already a presumption of equal custody then you would not be even talking about custody. The two of you would know that you are both suppose to equal raise and support your children and that it is an expectation that you both do it. From what you posted it would seem that you have resorted to using custody as a tool to fight so that you can have some economic stability via child support. Maybe you both need to tell him that you want equal custody but need to have support which under HB 4564 you would still get if one parent makes more money then the other. The Best Interest of the Child is to have both parents equally involved in their lives.

This law is only for fit, willing and able parents who live in the same school district/area so that their school schedule is maintained.

This bill is about what is best for both children which is to be able to maintain the stabiiity of their parental relationships. Why should a child be a part of their parent's breakup or disputes? Read the bill and you will see that this is only for fit parents and if there is clear and convincing evidence otherwise it will not apply. It also allows parents to agree on their own plan as long as the judge does not find clear and convinving evidence of a need to impose their will. www.achildsright.net

You say that you want your children's father to be involved as long as he is willing to pay support, is that really what is best for children. What about all those parents and the state for that matter who as a matter of routine deny a child a significant relationship with the parent who works so that support can be collected? Is it right that our state and most single parents use their children as a source of tax collections and income redistribution? HB 4564 does not eliminate child support it allows children their right to be raised by both of their parents.

The laws that where established 30 years ago have created an incentive for divorce and custody dispute. The result has been to have a significant amount of our children being raised without a real relationship with one parent. The standard custody order of 4-6 days a month of parenting time has been shown through research to harm the emotional development of children. Basing laws on a few individuals who may have succeeded inspite of the fact that they where denied a parent is pure foolishness.

My wife has just decided she wants a divorce and one of the first things she had to say was how much I was going to have to pay for support. We have not lived together for a year and a half and since then I bought a home and get our sons pretty much whenever I want, which is as much as possible. She has lived at her parents and is counting the days until she can start getting checks to pay for everything she wants, I currently make sure they need nothing. By choice she only works 24 hrs per week. I save, she goes out on the town, she had an FOC order set for one of our sons and it breaks me where I can't pay for my house. What do I get if she put the order into effect? Every other weekend and Wednesday evenings! FOC is a joke!

I don't beleive that a parent should pay child support just to be able to see their child however I believe that a parent should not go for joint custody just because he/she doesnt want to pay child support The economy is bad and money is not love quality time is love

I don't beleive that a parent should pay child support just to be able to see their child however I believe that a parent should not go for joint custody just because he/she doesnt want to pay child support The economy is bad and money is not love quality time is love

And she will get it the way the judges are in Michigan. Heavan help you if you get a woman. My ex was running to the bars, partying it up, and took me to the cleaners. Yet, unless she is a coke head they assume that the man is the problem. My advice go to a state appointed doctor for an evaulation with children and get her out in the open and stand up to her lawyer who will tell her to keep the children more than 50% to keep the checks flowing. As always, tell the children the truth, they will grow to know what mom is like, she can't hide forever behind lies. It's time these judges know all the facts, not what these woman lawyers lies tell them. Go to judges fund raiser dinners and tel everybody some of these cases so they have to defend themselves giving away all someone elses money. See what they think when their money stops, I bet they don't like it. Oh and get use to bankruptcy, you'll always qualify when she drains all your money. If you look at all the economy stats you'll find that when all these woman were getting divorces and takin all thier money that that is when the foreclosures started. Thank the judges. I have told my child everything that has happened to me in the past ten years and they respect me for the truth, his mom gets the burden of what she sews.

Joint physical custody is more strain on the children of Michigan that they do not need.

The real problem here is divorce. Divorce is destructive and selfish. If truly we parents were concerned about the best interests of our children, then we wouldn't put them through a divorce! What kind of future are we building for our children when we as adults put our own selfish interests ahead of our children? Divorce is wrong. It is detrimental to our society. It is the ultimate breakdown of the family. In addition it is statistically proven that children from divorce also divorce. Which means the divorce rate keeps going higher. Let's get rid of "no-fault" divorce and spend our money on marriage and family counseling to keep our families together. Then we won't need to be so concerned with custody. Don't get me wrong. I think this is a great bill. It is just so sad to me that we need it in the first place. What does it truly say about our society? Here's a challenge....Parents, let's work on our marriage relationships and make our priority to keep our families together, that will solve 100% of this problem.

Why is it that the Courts think that women can be better parents than men. I am working hard and trying to understand all the aspects of children and effects of shared custody. Bottom line is this all I want is to be a dad to my son! I am a well rounded individual that is successful and can provide a loving and caring home as well. Although I can do this the Courts seem to think that children are better off with their mothers the majority of the time. This is not right, I love and care for my son and deserve equal time with him as he progresses with age. I am all for shared custody that is implimented as a child grows in age so that there are no detachtment fears for my child.