Michigan Votes Forum

what? you can't say why a government would cut taxes if cutting taxes was a bad thing? the only excuse for it is BAD GOVERNMENT. so, how many times has jennie cut taxes???? BAD JENNIE....

You did your usual briklliant job of reinforcing the p[oints I've made. Nice job, simpleton.

all you did was rattle your jaws foolishly. good job name calling though. glad your indoctrination was so thorough.

what's a "briklliant"?

... the REAL Wingnut here, that is. Everybody knows you are playing an empty hand when you slap at your adversary over his or her typing skills. THat is what simpletons do. Fact is, you've proved, over and over again, every point made over the attitudes and behavior of the wacko utopian wingnuts who spew their crackpot no-taxes-no-gubmint lines ad nauseum, to cover up the reality that Michiganders are getting hurt by tax revenue shortfalls and resultant cutbacks in essential services. Of proposals made to restore some of that badly needed revenue, it is my considered opinion that boosting the state personal income tax rate from 3.9% to 4.6% is the least regressive (although flat taxes or tax rates are inherently regressive). Michigan certainly cannot tax itself into prosperity. But at the same time, calling incessantly to correct state budget deficiencies only by cutting back on legitimate and essential government activities such as road maintenance, police and fire protection, and education will not bring back prosperity, either. Rational people understand that a proper balance must be struck in the taxation and services equation. A proper balance is what the wingnut untopians will not accept, and it is a truth they attempt to shout down whenever the discussion opens. We've seen it here a jillion times.

essential services? please let us know that is so essential about the services the state provides, and so UN-essential about police and prisons. it's not the proper role of government to support you, it's your proper place to support government. if the government is wasting our money, it's proper to call it down. if the government cannot provide it's citizens with BASIC SERVICES like law enforcement and secure prisons, how can you expect it to provide you with a living?

a poster said... "Michigan certainly cannot tax itself into prosperity. But at the same time, calling incessantly to correct state budget deficiencies only by cutting back on legitimate and essential government activities such as road maintenance, police and fire protection, and education will not bring back prosperity, either." we're not asking for essential services like police and fire protection to be cut, but the governor cut it anyway.

everyone knows that slapping at that persons typing skills, or lack of them, is REALLY a slap at the democrat ideal of dumbing down the populace so that ideas like yours can take root. if you think YOUR taxes aren't high enough, slip a little extra into the pay envelope every year. i'm sure the government will spend it wisely. i think that the government should be as fiscally responsible as the people they tax. i have no sense of humor over a police department, either state, county, or local, overspending it's budget,(MY MONEY) nor do i plan on forgiving them for their irresponsibility. i have no sense of humor over a governor who uses 'scare tactics' such as firing police officers and releasing prisoners to force us to allow her to raise our taxes. nor do i plan on forgiving her for her irresponsibility. she took the easy road and made two TOKEN CUTS, which haven't helped our financial situation one little bit, but have served to raise the ire of the citizenry. this will only make it more difficult and more costly to raise taxes in the future. she DID NOT make the case that higher taxes were needed, and why. she simply said, "i'll fix them, i'll fire a bunch of cops and release a bunch of prisoners to show them who's really in charge." if she truly believed that this token would bring us back to prosperity, she is more stupid than even the far right wing give her credit for. our legislators know that in the current climate, any tax increase amounts to political suicide. the WILL OF THE PEOPLE has spoken, those who give us new taxes will not remain in office after the next election, unless she can fix it that the TAX PAYERS no longer have a vote.

This is just another example of the insanity in Lansing where with the stroke of pen you can get a raise,destroy businesses or reduce the living stanards for million of michiganders who are already suffering. I don't understand why they don't make more cuts I don't really care if 1600 cops are without a job to be honest just stay out of my pockets.The local communities will hire a couple extra patrol if it is that important to them.

to answer questions. not answering means he has no answer, and would rather not lie about his support, or lack of it, for the politicians who can't do the right thing.

state MORE MONEY going to stop it from overspending OUR MONEY? how is overspending your budget being fiscally responsible? i see NO MOVE towards FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY, only towards HIGHER TAXATION. are we getting MORE SERVICES for those taxes??? NO. we are barely getting the SAME services, and in TWO CASES we are getting LESS. police protection and prisons. fiscal responsibility is never the EASY way out, but it's the right thing for government to do.

Michigan is currently 14th in state & local tax burden. Not less than half. http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxdata/show/335.html

I am a rising senior in high school. I can't believe the lack of consideration people have for any sort of public structure at all. It sounds as if people want anarchy, which is not at all in the spirit of our American way of life. What is wrong with all of you? Honestly - take a good hard look at yourselves. What the heck happened? What happened to investing in the schools so that people in my generation have half a brain to care for your generation? What happened to SELF SACRIFICE? That is one of the biggest ideals that we have in America - we give a little, and get a huge reward. Look... the truth is that taxes were cut in 1999 over a 5-year period, and revenues decreased by a billion dollars. You have all trimmed enough. I feel the effects at school of so-called "Parent Choice" -- you know, saying it's okay if the state guarantees a certain level of funding to Charter Schools, but cutting our funds the moment the state budget is in crisis. If any of you people have ANY HOPE AT ALL for the future, then you will seriously rethink your ridiculous ideas about a society based on no government whatsoever. You will rethink your ideas to include something about investing in the future and giving an extra .7% of your income to help out your fellow men. Stop whining and being such babies. Grow a pair and give some more money to revitalize our state.

Charter schools suck. All of you here who claim that public schools are terrible, well it's because of idiots like you who cut the funding. I've tutored charter school students and they do not learn from any kind of cirriculum that will help them succeed in life. I'm also nearly positive that there is much research showing that Charter School students perform poorly on standardized tests on which the state wastes a TON of money. Get rid of the Michigan Math, Science, and Social Studies bullcrap, keep the ACT and WorkKeys et voila - you have your new MME with tons of cost saving measures right there. Maybe it will make the charter schools look better too, as their students really do not exceed the level of public students in most areas. HALLELUJAH TO THE LORD ABOVE FOR PUBLIC EDUCATION! --rising senior in high school

"well it's because of idiots like you who cut the funding." More money doesn't get us a better product so us "idiots" will continue to vote down any new money grab by the schools. Maybe if it was a appreciated a little more....You sound like a spoiled little kid, go out into the real world and learn something, until then just shut up and listen to the "idiots" that actually make the money and run the businesses that you want to rob.

spoiled little government school indoctrinated twits like you to say that the folks that make the money have to give you more. You sound like an ad for the teachers union. Learn the facts, more money does not equal better education. Wash D.C. spends twice what Livonia does and can't get most through to graduation. It's great if you want to stomp your feet and wet your pants but one day you will be in the real world and you're not going to like it. People actually expect results when they spend money. I don't expect you to understand this because your teachers have cheated you out of a true education. My guess is that you have loads of undeserved self esteem though. Go change your diaper and let the adults talk. "Stop whining and being such babies. Grow a pair and give some more money to revitalize our state."

and Got Nothing, You Gave Nothing Yet. We're done. "That is one of the biggest ideals that we have in America - we give a little, and get a huge reward."

You shut your mounth!

michigan went from having the 24th highest tax burden in 2004 to having the 14th highest tax burden this year. that must have been SOME tax cut to raise us HIGHER THAN TEN MORE STATES. RE CHECK YOUR FIGURES BEFORE YOU LIE TO US.

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ARE YOU KIDDING!!! THAT IS THE ANSWER FOR MICHIGAN ECONOMIC PROBLEMS. LETS SEE EVERYONE IS MOVING OUT SO DOWN GOES THE TAX BASE, OH BOY TOO TOUGH OF MATH FOR OUR LEGISLATIOR TO UNDERSTAND. HOW ABOUT THIS; IF YOUR REPRESENTING LESS PEOPLE MAYBE YOU NEED LESS REPRESENTATIVES. STARTING WITH George Cushingberry WHO INTRODUCED THE TAX INCREASE!! COMBINE HIS DISTRICT WITH SOMEONE THAT REPRESENTS SOMETHING OTHER THAN THERE OWN PAYROLL!

I'VE GOT AN IDEA HOW ABOUT THE WELLFARE BUMS GET OFF WELLFARE, INSTEAD OF TAXIN THE HARD WORKING INDIVIDUAL. I THINK I'VE SEEN ENOUGH YOUNG GIRLS MAKING BAD EVENING DECISIONS AND ENDING UP WITH THREE KIDS FROM TWO DIFFERENT GUYS ENDING UP BEING SUPPORTED BY ME AND EVERYONE ELSE WORKING. WHAT A BRILLIANT IDEAD, MAYBE THEY CAN LIVE WITH THE CONSEQUENCES OF THEIR OWN DECISIONS, INSTEAD OF FURTHER SWELLING THE ABYSMALLY LARE WELLFARE RANKS AND REQUIRING THE STATE TO TAX TAX TAX TO PROVIDE THEM WITH ALL THE AID AND CONFORMT THEIR POOR DECISIONS SHOULD DENY THEM, YOU TAXING LIBERAL IDIOT.

U.S. PUBLIC SCHOOLS SUCK AND ANY APPTITUDE COMPARATIVE YOU FIND BETWEEN THEM AND OTHER INDUSTRIALIZED NATIONS INDICATES THAT. IN FACT MOST U.S. PUBLIC SCHOOL TEACHERS AND THEIR UNIONS ARE AGAINST TEACHER TESTING. WHY? WHAT A SHOCK BECAUSE THEY WILL FAIL THE TEST, THEREBY PROVING THEY ARE NOT QUALIFIED TO TEACH THEIR RESPECTIVE SUBJECT MATTER.

NO TAX INCREASES WHATSOEVER, CUT ANY / ALL GOV'T SERVICES, SALARIES, PENSIONS, SOCIAL PROGRAMS !!!

MANY of us have already taken the state tests and passed the state tests. You shouldn't generalize or stereotype anyone, it isn't the American way.

Let's look at your post and find the truth of the situation. In the interest of full disclosure, let me start by saying that I am a special education teacher so I know personally about the situations you have commented about. Statement #1 -- IN FACT MOST U.S. PUBLIC SCHOOL TEACHERS AND THEIR UNIONS ARE AGAINST TEACHER TESTING. WHY? WHAT A SHOCK BECAUSE THEY WILL FAIL THE TEST, THEREBY PROVING THEY ARE NOT QUALIFIED TO TEACH THEIR RESPECTIVE SUBJECT MATTER. Response #1 -- When I became a certified teacher, I had to take a state test in addition to all of the tests, observations and assessments that were required in the university program. In addition, I had to take the Learning Disabilities subject test. Not one teacher I have ever encountered has protested against taking these tests, nor have the unions taken a stand against them. We are opposed to the proposition put forth that seeks to require that teachers take yearly tests. These yearly tests are not needed because we are already required to recertify every 5 years. They are also extremely costly (I paid over $100 for each of the tests that I took). Statement #2 -- U.S. PUBLIC SCHOOLS SUCK AND ANY APPTITUDE COMPARATIVE YOU FIND BETWEEN THEM AND OTHER INDUSTRIALIZED NATIONS INDICATES THAT. Response #2 -- Yes, some industrialized nations do outscore us but have you bothered to investigate why or have you merely jumped to the assumption that it is all the teachers' fault? I have bothered to investigate why. First of all, until those other countries start educating and testing all students like we do instead of only their best and brightest, any comparison among scores is comparing apples and oranges but that is a discussion for another day. Let's take a look at the other factors involved. Are their teachers better educated, more dedicated or better trained than ours? No, pound for pound US teachers are equal or superior to those of other countries. Are their students smarter than ours? No, probably theirs are more motivated but not smarter. Do the other countries have better teaching materials? No. Do the other countries have better curriculums? Yes, there they have us hands down. Most of the other countries teach fewer concepts per grade level, focusing on the ones that are truly essential. They are allowed to spend more time per concept and can teach the concept to mastery. Most of these countries have a nationalized curriculum. We do the exact opposite. Our curriculum is a mile wide and an inch deep. We have way too many concepts per grade level (thanks to too many special interests legislating that we teach this and this, depending on what their agenda is and how many legislators' ears they have). We are not allowed to teach to mastery because we have to get through so many concepts that we never have time to go back and reteach when the kids just aren't getting it. We have a wide variety in standards from state to state and we need to have a more standardized curriculum.

teachers are falling faster than a brick and occupy a spot below lawyers on most folks lists is that they don't teach as much as they indoctrinate. Who writes the class lesson that says you need to teach the kids that our commander in cheif is a moron? This is taught in lots of PUBLIC schools. Who writes the rules that say you have to teach that degeneracy is cool? If you didn't agree why don't you fight it? If you don't agree then just don't mention it in class. If you are teaching something you know to be wrong and harmful, how do you sleep at night? Who orders you to teach an ultra left liberal socialist viewpoint? My guess is that you guys were so indoctrinated in college that you may not even know that you are doing it If you folks would quit shoving a warped agenda down our kids throats and spending OUR MONEY to do it maybe you would get some respect. At the end of the semester not one of your students should know how you will vote in the next election....How many of you could pass THIS TEST?

are useless. Thats why they are state tests. Just lowere the standards until the right number of people can pass them.

Its the democrats way. Re-call Jenny!!!! I hate to say I told you so, BUT... I told you so!

I think we should test our federal and state congressmen, senators, governors, etc., for basic math & economics skills. I think most of them would fail. Just look at the State of Michigan as proof of this. I have always maintained that Lawyers cannot add. Granholm is proof of this. Have you ever used the services of a lawyer? They just seem to know how to spend and bill more. If you needed someone to run the accounting portion of your business, would you hire a lawyer to do it? NO of course not, you would hire an accountant. Lets face it Michigan is a business. Putting a Lawyer into the governors seat is equivalent to having a lawyer do your accounting. Not smart. So if you feel testing teacher is neccessary, then you must also agree that tesing politicians is neccessary. After all the whole state is at stake, with a bad politician.

is in getting elected. he does this by promising what you have to people who want it.

This teacher says they have to pay 100.00 dollars for each test they took? I thought that should read every test i have taken. But they are the teachers

Kids come to class unprepared! They have an entitlement attitude. Its really weird in the sports world "its always the coaches fault" or "its always the teachers fault" When are we gonig to start blaming the piss poor attitudes of the students!

I just went through a rigorous teacher education program in mid-life at a University close to lake Michigan. No where in my curriculum was I taught how to actually teach! Lots on No Child Left Behind classes cramming useless information down my thoat. I was never taught how to effectively communicate to a modern day student. Classes like "reading in the content areas" was totally worthless and robbed financial aid. People! I really don't know what to say other than its total horse shit! Districts violate state rules all the time-and put their fraternity buddies in the classroom. But an effective person from industry gets passed up! Go figure! Thats the way its is! Its incesteous! If you kiss the interview committeeS hind end! your In. Competent or not. Thats the state of education folks REPEAL THE TEACHER TENURE ACT NOW! Legislate a salary cap for all school employees to no more than $50K per year! Thats all their worth folks-but they eating your tax dollars and violating the school code left and right

Either phrase is grammatically correct.

Lawmakers need to get rid of their lifetime health care after only six years of service. We have the second highest paid lawmakers in the nation and the worst in employment. Tax and spend Lee Gonzales of the 49th district and Andy Coulouris of the 95th are the after your hard earned money. Remember, these people and others on election day. How is your 401k doing today?