Michigan Votes Forum

This law would not just benefit the rec rider, it would also be a safeguard for the common person who would use their atv/orv to plow thier neighbors driveway and not risk a ticket just to help someone.

We would comply to the laws, and yes we do spend spend spend...

You have obviously never ridden a dirtbike or ATV to say that it is not exercise - either that or you don't know how to ride. This is a no-brainer

>I would rather have 10 fun loving, money spending, freedom loving 4 wheelers in my business than 100 bird watching, tree hugging contol freaks that just want to sit in the woods and count sparrows.< I think you are expressing loused up values that are based on intolerance. But, what the hey, it’s a free country and you can make whatever asinine remark you wish, we suppose. Like you, I don’t care for control freaks, including those who (intentionally or otherwise) control by interfering with others’ QUIET enjoyment. The problem is, ORVs and ATVs and quiet enjoyment pastimes just don’t mix very well. The machines quickly overwhelm and displace the quiet activities. That’s why the State of Michigan segregated ORVs and ATVs from lower impact activities years ago. Things are about right as they are now, balanced, and everybody gets a decent chance to enjoy their preferred recreation. This legislation would disturb the balance and is neither needed nor desireable.

why can't YOU be tolerant of ORV riders? that would be completely out of the question. you have no desire to be TOLERANT of anyone who disagrees with YOUR point of view, as narrow as it is. you wish all ORV'S to be banned from roads altogether. another right/freedom snatched away from the good people of michigan.

I live in Lansing and have a cottage near Kalkaska. It sure would be nice if you "quite activity" people would get off your rear end and head up north. I see business upon busines closed or for sale everytime I head north. Families are going bankrupt. If you read the wording of this bill you will understand that fines for speeding and enviromental damage (including noise) are very steep (up to $500). I'm sure the "I'll just have water with a slice of lemon" crowd will never agree but the rest of us know better. This is good business.

The bill is about the legal right to ride on the shoulder of the road. It would make it easier for all outdoor enthusist, who ride Atv or Orv's.

Note that this bill has been changed quite a bit since it was introduced. As reported to the House, it now would permit ORV use in the TRAVELED LANE portion of county roads and city streets, in counties north of Bay and Oceana. The bill makes no mention of use of the shoulders one way or the other. It would not apply on state highways. County boards of commissioners could pick and choose how many miles to open to ORV's, and would not be limited to either 0 or 70-100 per cent of route-miles, as in the first edition. The bill does not say whether county roads would be "posted open" or "posted closed." The speed limit of 25 mph remains in the bill.

I don't see a difference between this and allowing snowmobiles to ride shoulders. The result is the same - greater tourist interest and also getting those tourists into the economically struggling towns.

I understand the noise concerns, but how quiet to you expect a ROAD to be? That's what this bill is about, right? allowing ORV's to operate where CARS already drive. I am an ORV/dual sport enthusiast, as well as an avid kayak and backpacker. My family and I do all of these activites in Northern MI. If hearing a motor (car or ORV)really ruins the outdoor experience for you, then get out of your CAR, get some excecise and hike a few miles away from the road!

if this bothers you so much talk to your state reps. and get over it

talk to my rep about this bill. but being in the pocket of the motorsports, motor fuel and commercial lobbies, he voted for it anyway. no matter. in the end, i'll just spend my recreational tourist money where ORVs and ATVs are properly regulated, whether that's in the smarter Michigan counties, or in another state.

I am from northern Indiana and used to go to Michigan with motorcycles in the 1970'S along with thousands of other out of state tourists. That was until Michigan began harassing everyone so bad. It has gotten to the point hear that if you mention going to Michigan to ride, people get very upset because of bad experiences with your DNR. I now ride ATV's and last fall went to Ogemaw county and had a great time. It's about time Michigan gets on the ball, you should see what in happening in trail areas in Kentucky and West Virginia. If you pass this bill, get ready because there are thousands of people here that would love to go to your state, with lots of money,if they would not be harassed. You have a lot of beautiful trails. It's to bad that they have been empty for so many years along with your bank accounts.

When was the last time that I saw a jogger or a bicylist riding down a snow mobile trail? Let me think about it hmmm....... NEVER!

Pass or not you might hear the sound of my Firebird, which has stock exhausts, is very street legal, but has more of a rumble that the rice burner that you probably drive. If you put my Firebird next to my Polaris Ranger and start them both, even at idle you would swear that I never started the ranger. Even slightly step on the gas in both and you will not hear the Ranger. Your quite argument with regards to this bill is a bunch of bunk. In the long run we (yes, unlike you I live in northern Michigan year round) will attract more dollars with the passage of the law than we will loose. We are talking about allowing the passage of ATVs on the STREETS with this bill so that ATVs can get from one established trail to the next. Just like the snowmobiles do now. You want to talk about doing something really substantial, expand the trail system and make it comparable to that of the U.P. Then we will be talking. Allow the use of existing snowmobile trails for ATV use. I find it amazing that someone who would visit northern Michigan for one to two weeks a year has the never to try and tell us how to live our lives and provide for our families the other fifty/fifty one weeks of the year. Please , in your case, by all means vote with your wallet and stay down state. The rest of you are welcome anytime. You would think that you would want to encourage economic growth in whatever form it might take since the auto industry is in the toilet. Truely amazing.....

Grrrrrrrrrrr. "the enjoyment of those who prefer to walk a few yards down the road to visit their neighbors." If you expect to see ATVs screaming down the streets of town up here you are STONED! Most of the larger cities that do not depend on things like the snowmobile traffic ban the use of snowmobiles in town. This will be the same. Other cities such as Alanson that thrive on the snowmobilers and their business will allow them in town. You must be from Detroit or GR os someplace like that. My nearest neighbor is about a mile and half away.

Is this the same group of inocent bicylist that think that they OWN the road? The bicyclist that I see blow through stop signs, ride on the sidewalks, ride against traffic. They are suppose to observe the same traffic laws as motorist. However they repeatedly get a bye because... gee I cant think of a reason why they should. BAN BICYCLES BECAUSE THEY DONT FOLLOW THE EXISTING LAWS THAT GOVERN THEIR ACTIONS? Dont even try to make the bicycle arguement. I see them riding on the side of the street when there is a perfectly good state/county funded bike trail not 30 feet from them that is in better shape than the roads. What really torques me out of shape is that I was taxed for its construction and continue to be taxed for its maintenance and they refuse to use it. And on top of that I am taxed for the maintenence of the road through my fees for licensing of my vehicles etc. and they use it for their bicycles and then gripe about it all the time when the devices that the roads were intended for attemt to use it.

I live in Schoolcraft Co in the U.P. We now have open county roads and here is how it works. No body wants to ride county roads, they are dusty and sometimes car, truck busy. What they do provide is a means to get into the National Forest and Michigna state lands. A means to purchase fuel and food from local retailers in remote areas, during a ORV outing. I Live on a rual county road with ORV traffic. I do hear the ORV traffic but it is MUCH LESS intruding then the large truck taffic that passes by and less frequent. Trust me it's not gonna be a problem.

You sound pretty bike experienced so I thought I'd ask you ... My husband just got Yamaha dirt bikes for him and our son. We live north of Indianapolis. Can you tell me some places where they can go dirt biking? We also would like to go places where we can camp and ride with the kids. Any ideas would be helpful. Thanks!

Maybe you can give me some guidance ... hubby just bought dirt bikes for our son and him and were trying to find places where they can go riding. We're north of Indianapolis. We'd also like to go camping somewhere in IN, KY, OH or MI where they can rides the dirt bikes and our firends can come with their ATVs. Any ideas would be helpful since we're new to this! Thanks. themolloys@insightbb.com

I too have been harassed by the DNR. Now keep in mind that I'm 40 and have NEVER had a ticket or point on my license. It happened just west of Grayling. No tickets were issued. We lost the trail and crossed a dirt road in the middle of no where. The conservation officer acted as if we were felons. We got a 45 minute lecture. We were called stupid and blind. We were informed that these trails were paid for by "locals" and we shoud go back "down state". When I parked at the staging area I wondered why we were the only one's on such a beautiful day, now I know! Crawford Co, get your DNR under control!

from the plethora of confusing laws on the books in michigan. things are illegal here that are not illegal anywhere else in the country, or the world for that matter. it's illegal for an off road vehicle to cross a dirt road, for heavens sake. i can understand it being illegal to trespass on an off road vehicle, or even to commit crimes on an off road vehicle, but to simply cross a dirt road??? how much kool-aid have the citizens of michigan consumed lately?

"The conservation officer acted as if we were felons. We got a 45 minute lecture. We were called stupid and blind." Just one more example of what you get when the state is allowed to expand without limit--conceited bullies filling out the ranks of yet another government jobs program, all pumped up fulla pisnvinegar over some nebulous, perceived transgression against some department-mandated pseudoreligion (child welfare, education, highway safety, or in this case, "the environment.") Then they wonder why the tourists stay away.

to quit paying the 'retarded pit bulls' and stop funding the department that put them there. it's not their job to keep orv's off the road shoulders, it's their responsibility to assure that hunters are hunting safely and legally. maybe if they were BUSIER doing their jobs, instead of taking on traffic enforcement, we would all be better off.

Just how do you “lose the trail” when riding an ORV on a legally designated route? Every ORV trail in Michigan, or anywhere else, is chewed to H by the machines. Maybe he shouldn’t have said it aloud, but the conservation officer hit the nail on the head when he said you must have been either blind or stupid to lose the trail. Or, maybe he was actually being nice – making an excuse for your patently scofflaw behavior. And then somebody complains about conservation officers spending time chasing down ORV rules violators rather than game law violators. Well, if we didn’t have machine mounted hooligans running around in the woods where they aren’t supposed to, violating the law and damaging whatever they run on or over wherever they go, the conservation officers wouldn’t have to chase them down, now would they?

you think that orv's don't belong in the woods? has someone TOLD you that, or did you come up with it all by yourself? if the woods are private property, then whoever and whatever the property owner allows belongs in those woods. if the property is state owned, then everybody has access to it, whether on an orv, on foot, on horseback or on a tractor. it's ALL OUR PROPERTY and NOT YOURS. as a police officer, i understand the importance of enforcing the law, but i also understand what is, and what isn't my job responsibility. maybe the d.n.r. needs to learn that lesson as well.

u can get off the orv tral very easy asshole

which proves the point about stupidity.

Michigan is not pedestrian unfriendly! I spend days upon end "walking" down the edge of trout streams fishing and through the woods hunting. I have never been in harms way concerning an atv. We could use this up here in the northern lower.

Orv riders that ride responsibly should be treated properly. As long as the orv rider is not tear-assing around leave them alone and go after the dope-head, booze drinking poachers and people dumping trash in the woods.As for getting off the trails in the woods it's certainly possible to get on a closed one that's parked in the middle of the open ones. The guy that thinks you can't get off a trail probably doesn't ride an ORV and hates the fact that anyone is enjoying the outdoors. get a life grumpy!

An evident supporter of this bill posts: >The guy that thinks you can't get off a trail probably doesn't ride an ORV and hates the fact that anyone is enjoying the outdoors. get a life grumpy!< I have a life, and a very enjoyable one, thank you. A substantial part of it is spent walking in the woods. So, no, I don’t “hate the idea that anyone is enjoying the outdoors.” I do not approve of tearing up the land indiscriminately in order to gain enjoyment. I do not understand how defacing and destroying natural areas is enjoyable. ORV trails are well worn and well marked. The law and regulations are clear about ORV use, and are well known. There is no acceptable or good excuse for going off trail with an ORV / ATV except in those few areas where “cross country” travel is specifically permitted. The majority of ORV / ATV riders I encounter are respectful of the rules and of other people who share and enjoy the outdoors with them. That is to their credit. But invariably, wherever I go, it is very clear that some riders are either incredibly stupid, blind or simply have no respect for rules that govern their vehicles’ use. Their abuse is very visible. They give the entire population of ORV enthusiasts a black eye. This bill only will encourage more abuse and violation of trail regulations if it becomes law and counties elect to open their roads to ORV traffic. I do not see that as a good or desirable thing, from any perspective.

I own 3 ATV's and live in southeast Michigan. I am also an avid hunter and fisherman in this great state of OUR'S. I get discussted when I go Turkey or Deer hunting on State (our) owned land only to be disturbed by some " water with lemon please" type walking their dog every day, whom by the way pays nothing in liscense fees to maintain our land. While I pay $16.25 per year for each machine to only be able to ride on the designated ATV trails which are so narrow and dangerous you can't even feel safe with your kids riding on them. The only folks with any smarts are the ones in the U.P. They realize that we as familys will come to ride into the towns and enjoy the local restaurants and shops and spend our hard earned money on a family vacation. Not having to worry about the DNR or local police trying to take our vacation money for themselves in the way of fines as is the current state of the northern lower. WAKE UP MICHIGAN, THE CHEAP ASS SENIORS THAT HAVE BUILT IN OUR RECREATION AREAS WILL NOT FLOAT YOUR BOAT, YOU NEED OUR MONEY! MAKE THEM PAY THEIR SHARE TO WALK STATE LAND LIKE HUNTERS AND FISHERMAN AND ATVIST DO!!! Joe Wyandotte, MI

I recently had the opportunity to spend time in Lake Havasu City Arizona. This is a resort community on the Colorado river with a population of 55,000 people. ATV's and the larger side by side riding position ORV's are licensed by the state of Arizona and drive around town just like automobiles. Most have had replacement tires installed because original equipment tires were not designed for pavement. Men and women drive ORV's around town for recreation and for shopping, going to the doctor, bank, etc. They are used because of the "fun factor" and for gasoline savings. They are considered just another vehicle on the road. I believe our elected officials are right in exploring the use of ORV's on public roads. They allow snowmobiles, don't they?

We have a cottage in Clare County and bring our family up there (or at least we did) all the time to ride snowmobiles AND ATV's. Two summers ago we bought trail permits, outfitted everybody with protective gear and tried to ride the ORV Trail at Leota. Let me tell you, it was downright dangerous. Narrow, rocky, etc.(and I am an experienced rider) We somehow took a wrong turn and thought we were following the right trail....until a DNR officer stopped us and told us otherwise. He lectured us for over 2 hours and then issued us several tickets for $85 dollars each. Needless to say we never came back. I am an AMA Member (America Motorcyclist Assoc.) and teach our kids the importance of safety and respect for the land. To me this bill would be a godsend to the tourism industry up there. I hope it passes (we can ride ATV's on the side of the road here in Ohio). I am an avid snowmobiler also and of course they are allowed on the side of the road (since Day 1). I could never understand why Michigan would never give the same privilege to ATV's. And could never understand why ATV's could not use existing snowmobile trails. Now don't tell me about "tearing up the trails". Right now you have ORV trails paralleling snowmobile trails with double the signage and double the maintenance. Why not just one set of trails and with the ability to "get there" with this Bill as well as restaurants, gas stations, etc. this would be the best of both worlds (winter and summer). Michigan needs money and I and all my friends would gladly pay whatever fees to ride ATV's just like snowmobiles and also spend our money again up there. Sorry for the long comment, but this Bill is GOOD FOR MICHIGAN. If this passes I (along with tons of my friends and families) WILL BE BACK. Thanks for your time. Rick Unverferth Kalida, Ohio

Just wonder how long the Bill will be in the Senate (I see it's in committee now). It passed the House in just a month. Just anxious I guess and hope that some day we can ride from our cottage to the trails, gas stations, restaurants, etc. Pass it, Michigan !!

I'll tell you how I lost the trail. Logging. The state allows logging and makes big $$$ from it. The logging company's destroy the woods and leave a huge mess that covers an exsisting trail making it near impossible to follow. Plus I'm a MOTORCYCLE rider. I ride the "skinny trails". I'm not a hooligan. I don't damage anything. Trail signs can be VERY CONFUSING. Sometimes I wonder if that's on purpose. I belong to the MCCC (Michigan Cycle Conservation Club). Talk to most members and they will tell you that the DNR can go a little overboard at times. I have been harrased. A lot of my non-hooligan friends have also been harrased. By the way, I drove by the Grayling ORV/Cycle parking area on Sunday around noon, it was empty.

Why should anyone have to pay to walk their their dogs on state land? I enjoy doing that and I pay my fair share of taxes in my community Your such a JERK!

I am opposed to this. The noise pollution will be significant, and it will damage the roads. The road commissions are opposed to it for good reason.

First I would I would suggest to anyone who is opposed to this law needs to spend some time in the U.P. of MI. Talk to the locals and get their opinion before “GUESSING “ what will happen. I ride out of Rexton, MI and the ATV friendly people are GREAT. Call the local gas station there, the owner will tell you the Labor Day weekend has been her busiest in a year INCLUDING the snowmobile season. I haven’t heard one local person complain about the ATV’s riding on their road shoulders. Most of us are very respectful when riding down the roads i.e. low speeds... I also would like to point out that this law is about riding on county roads, NOT the state lands. If you’re a local resident it’s your concern about riding on the shoulders. BUT as for the state lands they belong to EVERY State resident and the out of State people who pay for the permits. It also should be pointed out that these lands were bought and paid for by HUNTING license revenue and still are. Now the snowmobile trail permit fees and the OVR revenues are also helping secure more state lands and maintaining trail systems. So keep in mind if you’re walking your dog or hiking in these great lands remember those hunters who paid for these in the first place, a wave an a smile wouldn’t hurt.

I also ride in the U.P of MI I have yet to see the damaged roads. Also this law has monies built in to repair damaged created by ORV's. I agree with the "suggest" poster, go talk to the people that already have this happening in their area. If you really enjoy and want to help your local business you can't go wrong with this law. I have seen it firsthand. Most local business need the tourism to help offset cost associated with running a business in northern MI. But it’s also important everyone should have their concerns addressed.