Michigan Votes Forum

Introduced in the Senate on January 30, 2007, to allow local governments in Oakland County to establish speed limits on gravel or dirt roads that are lower than the state "prima facie" speed limit, which is determined according to how many residences are on the road, regardless of whether or not it is paved. Note: On Nov. 9, 2006 a new law went into effect raising this state "prima facie" speed limit on dirt and gravel roads. Before then many of these roads had lower limits

The vote was 38 in favor, 0 opposed and 0 not voting

(Senate Roll Call 159 at Senate Journal 56)

Click here to view bill details.

The state setting local speed limits is absurd. Where there are no sidewalks or bike paths, and often no shoulders, read rural, the state thinks 45 is OK? What the hell do legislators eat that makes them think they are smarter than everyone else?

This bill rights a wrong done by a group of people who do not have a clue as to the real life conditions that they chose to administer speed limits for. It should be up to the people most impacted when it comes to rural gravel road speed limits, not those in a remote ivory tower!

Local people local control that is what it is all about if you ask me.I don't understand what s-4 is tough I tryed to figure it out but looking up this stuff is hard with dial up any one know what the subsitute s-4 is?

This will let every little podunk town drop their limits and write lots more tickets. The giant cash grinder keeps churning along and is evermore hungry for our money. Between this and the fees queen jenny levys everybody wins, oh, except for us serfs.

S-4 is the edition of SB 117 reported to the Senate floor last Tuesday. This bill is still woefully defective. It requires restoration of all the (improper and illegal) 25-mph speed limits that were in effect up until November 9, 2006 on gravel roads in Oakland County, on road segments within 300 feet of any house. The bill will lose effect at the end of 2012, or if the road commission and State Police ever complete speed studies on every gravel road in the county. Oakland County has almost 800 miles of gravel roads, so that is obviously never going to happen. But why should local governments have control over speed limits? That is utterly unfair. The people paying the taxes should have control of their public facilities. As the Road Commission for Oakland County tirelessly tells us, Oakland County property owners contribute EXACTLY NOTHING to the construction and upkeep of roads. One hundred per cent of the cost of county roads and state highways is paid for by auto drivers. Why should someone who buys a house along a road have the ability to deprive taxpayers of the use of what they've paid for? It sounds like a line from an old joke, but as an auto user, "As a matter of fact, I DO own the road." This bill deserves to be vetoed again, just like last time.

At least the "ivory tower" people don't set the speed traps in little money hungry podunk towns.

As a resident of one of those “Podunk towns," I rather enjoy a somewhat less frantic pace of life and travel. That’s why I live where I do. And I resent the city slickers and miscellaneous Yahoos who think they should be entitled to tear along my community’s roads at any speed they want to go, with complete disregard and disrespect for my peace and quiet, kids, pets, elderly neighbors, and so on. There are few ways we who live in smaller communities actually have control over the environment in which we live. Speed limits on our local roads inconvenience nobody and provide a limited means to maintain quality of life out here in the sticks. The defect in this legislation (SB 117) is that it applies only to Oakland County, and that it contains a sunset clause. It should apply across the entire state, permanently, to reverse the State's seizure of local control through PA 85 of 2006.

First, I used to live on a gravel road, out in the Boondocks. Nothing like trying to take a walk down "your" road and having some IDIOT race down the road, spitting gravel in your face. Second, according to your logic, if the people who live on the dirt road own cars, then they do own the road and should be able to set the frickin' speed limit.

on the dirt road PAY TAXES, then they do own the road, and ALL the taxpayers have to decide what the speed limit should be, not just a few. make your case for lower speed limits, THEN let the voters decide.

ALL VEHICLES on your road have to go? 25? 20? remember, the speed limit ALSO APPLIES TO police cars and ambulances. even though they seldom pay any attention to it until they wreck.

Why should oakland county be the only ones to enjoy the freedom of setting speed limits for the roads in their community.THIS IS CRAP CRAP CRAP!!!!!

We like to walk our dog or ride our bikes or horses, but now that this bill 117 is tied up it is walk at your own risk, drivers are supposed to drive to the road conditions (rain, snow etc) but they drive like they are on I 75 and very few slow down when you are walking some dirt roads you have no where to go but the ditch to get out of the way of a seeding car. We drive 25 mph and they try to pass you. They need to keep the speed limit at 25 mph on gravel roads we have moved out here for many reasons and the speed limit was 25 mph when we moved here in 1993. 55 mph is to fast on a gravel road.

i have driven on snell roads for 30 years -- 25mph does not make any sense -- why are we the only county which needs to be exempt from the new law

I am not sure how many people live on Snell Road, but our dirt road is not very wide and it has curves, and people like to take walks and ride horses and our speed limit has been posted as 25 mph for over 10 years, it needs to stay at 25 mph because speeds up to 55 mph is to fast for our road and people lack commen sense when driving they do not know how to drive to the condition of the road.

The example is given above of a gravel county road with curves, that might prevent drivers from seeing pedestrians and horse riders. This is a good example of why raising the legal speed limit can improve traffic safety. In the case of limited sight distance over a hill or around a curve, the appropriate safety remedy is a yellow "advisory" speed sign showing a recommended speed of 25 mph or some other reduced number. If the whole road is posted at an unrealistically-low 25 mph, it is no longer possible to post a 25-mph advisory sign at the site of a real hazard. Too-low speed limits convey the message that all traffic signs can be ignored. Any driver who has been driving for a few decades will have safely ignored hundreds of thousands of meaningless speed-limit signs. What good will it do to post another meaningless sign, after most drivers have experienced a half million repetitions of the message that all speed limits are too low by 10 or 20 mph?

When we moved several years ago to the gravel road we now live on the speed limit was posted 25 mph to this day it is posted 25 mph. And since the law was changed and people can drive up to 55 mph or to road conditions it has turned into a nightmare it can be pouring down rain and they are driving as fast as they can they will pass you if you are not driving fast enough for them even in the curves they do not slow down. When you are trying to ride your bike or go for a walk. In a short span of our gravel road we have four houses that all have children that live in them, four in one home, six in another, three children in another, and we have two. Where do we go for a walk or ride our bikes without the fear of being run over by a speeding car or truck it happens all the time and they do not slow down, when we moved here the speed limit was 25 mph it should stay that way that was another reason we moved on this gravel road it was and still is posted 25 mph. And I know they are not going to anything about the signs until something happens with the bill again.

I don't think that the speed limit on Snell Road should be 25 mph. What it does it sets up situations where vehicles pass other vehicles making it even more hazardous than the 55 mph speed limit. I don't believe 55 is a safe speed limit, but 25 is ridiculous-- this isn't a heavily traveled road at all. They need to make the speed 40 mph which I believe most drivers feel safe driving. Most of the time, you can't even get up to 40 because of the awful road conditions, i.e. potholes, washboard effect, ice that stayed on the road for 2 months, etc. The people that live along Snell have Stoney Creek Metro Park directly across the road for access to beautiful walking trails. Why would anyone want to walk along a road when they could take a walk in the park? All the 25 mph speed limit is good for is putting money in the pocket of the police department. They sit and wait for you on Snell road, when they could be spending time watching for people driving crazy on really busy streets! Until they can look at this objectively, they need to keep the speed limit at 55mph.

55 is the max your allowed to go within conditions, not the set speed limit! i go 40 down nearly every dirt road i drive on.

Howabout: letting people purchase a "20mph over permit" for $300 a year. In the leftmost lane you could travel 20mph hour over general speed limit, without getting a ticket. If the cop stops for alledged speeding, and you demonstrate a valid permit, you are let go, and the cop would have to have to try some other driver instead. This would greatly reduce cops trying to milk money from safe drivers, since the majority of the stops would be fruitless, putting more focus on dangerous driving habits rather than absolute speed. As additional safety: getting into an accident wether own or others fault, would cancel your eligibility for 20mph over permit for the next 3 years.

I'd even pay $300 for a lifetime permit.

Books. That's why they think they are so smart.

Why should I have to be late for something just because you want to live a slow boring life?

Snell Road is straight and wide for most of its length and even has some paved portions. There are very few residences along the road, to the point where you can sometimes go a quarter of a mile without passing a single house. Yet the speed limit is 25 for the entire portion. It needs to be raised to something like 40.

all they want is your money anyhow.