Michigan Votes Forum

That is so true I think Granholm should have to live in a trailer park and make 30,000.00 a year and see how well she fares after getting a ticket or trying to feed her family if they cut the wages of most the people around and under her maybe we wouldn't be in the crisis we are

A federal lawsuit is about to be filed in New York State against the New York State Department of Motor Vehicles, Driver Responsibility Assessment Program. What the New York State DMV is doing is taking a traffic ticket after a person has already been before the court and had that ticket discharged. The New York State DMV takes that same ticket, and adds points to it. Thats right! Adds points to it and sends out a Driver Responsibility Assessment Statement, informing the person that they have points on their driving record, and because of these points the must pay another fine or thier driver licesne will be suspended. New York State DMV has violated the 5th Amendment, 8th Amendment, 14th Amendment under color of law! Look up the term color of law! It is also FRAUD AND CONTEMPT OF COURT! Altering a courts decision... Well if this lawsuit against the New York State DMV is won. Then it will effect everyone else in other states because this is a federal issue, not a state so this lawsuit can be used in Michigan and Texas. Want to read more go here: www.jguntherphotography.com Click on the link that says New York State Driver Responsibility Assessment Statement is unconstitutional...

I am 43 and lost my license in '87. I live in a small town that has no type of public transportation. The county wanted their money and the only way i had to pay them was to continue to drive and naturally i was caught driving. This was a revolving door situation, until i had enough that i was charged and convicted of habitual motor offender. I was sentenced to 4 years in the pen and was told that all my court costs and fines would be nollied because i flattened my time. When i was released i began to inquire about getting them back. I found out that the court and the judge turned all my past judgements over to a collection agency. Now i have to pay this agency off before the state of tennessee will even think about reinstating my license. All my costs should be squashed because i served day for day on each charge i was sentenced. I feel that the state should help people in my situation because if the law would've been the way it is now i know i would've never got the 2nd d.u.i.

hey we know we did wrong were trying to figure out how to resolve the problem. not someone who doesnt have anyting to do but harass us that trying to help ourselves and each other.

Remember this people! You can filke your own Pro Se lawsuit against the State of Michigan. You can go on-line and down load the forms or you can go to your federal court house and pick up a Pro Se packet. Fill out the appropriate form, in this case it would be: Civil Rights Complaint Pursuant to 42 U.S.C. 1983. After you've filled out this form and stated the facts and the constitutional violations, Like no due process, which is a 14th Amendment violation, or 5th Amendment, double jeopapardy, being penalized again for the same traffic offence. Then either mail it or file it with the filing fee back to the federal cleks office for processing. Or enough of you can get together somewere and file your own class action lawsuit against the State of Michigan. And to hell with the lawyers, this is their bread and butter. Not one is going to help you file this lawsuit because you will win and this Driver Assesssment will be come unconstitutional and stricken from the books. Also you have 3 years from the time that these fines and penalties were illegally impose on you to file this federal lawsuit. So it doesn't matter if you fined back in November of 2004 you can still file a lawsuit, but you hade better hurry! You three year time limit to file this federal lawsuit will expire...

You can file a federal lawsuit! They had no right to do that to you! They have violated you 14th Amendment right of due process. Due process requires that a hearing be held for you to challenge them. So file a federal lawsuit under: Civil Rights Complaint Pursuant to 42 USC 1983. This is not difficult to do!

Noone is saying that we're not responsible for the actions we performed. The complaint is that we did something stupid and that we're being severely overtaxed/overpunished for those actions. i had to pay over $3000 for my fee's. Over 3 tickets in Walker that cost me $988 already. One fee of $500 should be more than enough. But telling us we have to may more per offense plus an extra 200 for this crap per year? thats unfair

I am all for responsibility. Every punishment should fit the crime. If punishment is too lenient legislature can increase penalties. It is right to apply severe penalty for severe crime. It is also against a law of this land to punish two or more times for the same crime. Unfortunately Michigan Driver Responsibility Law clearly violates Double Jeopardy clause in 5-th Amendment to the Constitution It doesn’t matter what you call it. Legislators call it “fee”. The “fee” results from previous judgments and is not voluntary. It doesn’t matter that “fee” relates to a group of previous offences. It serves as an extension of previously settled punishments. So in fact it is a second or third punishment for whatever was a source of assessment points within a fraction of the “fee”. I am not a lawyer and I can see it – how come legislators of whom most are lawyers and/or have lawyers on their staffs fail to notice it. The “fee” is not a fee. It is an extra penalty on violation cases already closed and concluded. It is common practice to charge and panelize different first time offenders than multiple offenders of the same crime. So this scenario already had been taken into consideration. Obviously there is a problem with a motive of passing such a law. Public safety or interest doesn’t fit here. Does public benefit from sending lives of Michigan residents into financial corkscrew without a hope? What happened to a democratic justice principle of being able to pay a debt to the society for committed offence and to start anew? Michigan Drivers responsibility law takes away a hope from life of many residents, and for many the crime doesn’t fit punishment. Crimes vary in their weight. Driving without insurance because one can’t afford it is nor as serious as drunk driving and having accident as a result. So what’s the motive? Obviously – money. State needs it – but who doesn’t? Obviously those who are least able to defend themselves, and are in highest in numbers, once more fall a victim to yet another sham to funnel money to state. Hiding behind false labels legislators are attempting to shift a weight of state funding to those less fortunate. I didn’t forget a fact that former governor, John Engler, with republican than legislature was generous to spend state surplus money on tax refunds to those that need them least. In a climate of already slipping economy this put instantly the state budget in jeopardy. New legislature instead to get reality check and too deal with a problem of budget cowardly passes a buck to mostly working poor people. Coming back to idea of responsibility I really would like to start a grass roots drive to pass a law that lawmakers will be responsible financially and criminally for actions they take. If you introduced and/or voted for the bill that would cause a loss of jobs without first creating replacement jobs than you should be punished. If you introduced and/or voted for a budget that is not balanced in reality not only on a paper than you should be punished. Etc, etc...

I was first informed of the driver responsibility fee after I was convicted of driving on a suspended license (for refusing to wear a seatbelt which i still refuse to wear today, but that's a different battle). I was totally taken by surprise with this as this was simply assessed and a letter was sent to me telling me pay up or else I'd never see my license again. Further I was informed I wouldn't be punished twice, but three times! once by the court, twice by the state. I was assessed 3 driver responsibility fees totalling $1500.00. I'm a diabled veteran who served both my federal and state govenment honorably for many years. I now live on $880.00 per month. Needless to say I cannot pay such an insane repeated punishment. Two weeks ago the police came to my door with a warrant for my arrest in the middle of the night (a nazi tactic). They took me to Grand Haven, around 20 miles away, and forced me to ransom myself back for $178.00. I was then escorted out the door into 30 degree weather with no coat to walk 20 miles back home where I proceeded to have a mental meltdown and almost killed myself after realizing that no place in this world is safe from these "home bred terrorists". I also found that while I was walking home they used this arrest to get a warrant, break in my door and ransack my house ant took everything of value, meaning my computer and expensive digital camera, and all my copyrighted digital photography looking for kiddy porn that I have no interest in. To this day I wonder what they are putting on my computer to charge me with next. Not only do I think that this driver responsibility fee should be repealed, but the state of michigan should also be monetarily punished for doing wrong as they punish us for doing wrong. I also think the cops have way more power than they need to do whatever they want and that power should be taken away since they abuse it regularly.

The out come of a lawsuit in New York State. Will effect what happens to the people in Michigan and all other states. November 13, 2007 Gunther v. New York State Department of Motor Vehicles et al NY Northern Mordue Other Civil Rights Civil Rights Act Plaintiff: Joseph Luke Gunther; Defendant: New York State Department of Motor Vehicles, Nancy Naples, Karen T. Gharhartt, Ida L. Traschen

so your father was killed by a drunk driver the rest of us should pay for this bull%$# i had a cousin who was killed by a drunk driver and i have no problem with people who drink and drive responsibly furthermore i am from a country that ceased to exist sometime back where drunk was 2.0 or above kids clothes fit them not a bunch of sh$t on tv queers were beaten up and the world was not run by disneyland you could shoot your dog if he was old or sick and we did not pay 5 trillon dollars for police we did not need it was called land of the brave home of the free not land of the policed home of the taxed further more i live by traverse city mi where the police constantly get away with lying under oath drinking and driving embezzling money and there has been people injured and even died in the shithole g.t. county jail

When someone is killed it is called murder uunless it happens in a jail or by the hands of a man in uniform then it is called justice.the united states has 5% of the worlds populatiton but 25% of the worlds prison population also more kids in jail than any other country just more proof that all laws are corrupt and misinterpeted by those elected to enforce them.

wheater you may agree with this DRF or not, ask yourself this question. Looking at the law for what it is, would you be in agreement on a law that says, "once you pay your fine, you pay your fine again!?!? Sounds like the craziest thing in the world, don"t it. And then you say to yourself, "man, as soon as this thing gets on the ballot, put me down for a big no". Oh, wait, state reps. passed this "TAX" without giving you the right as a tax paying citizen of this great state to vote on this. Kinda like, they knew we would say no on this one. But when you have buisnesses leaving the state, economy in the toilet, I guess you look for ways to generate revenue. Even if it is wrong. Say you get popped for this, license suspended. You pay and state says that it is unpaid (happenes more than you would believe) and license remaines under suspension. Now, you are a man with wife and children that you have to support. Are what are you going to do? Cant always get a ride work and we dont have subways. Are you going to illegally drive to work in the name of supporting your family? In this instance, do the ends justify the means?

Drive illegally to work if you have to but drive. But Michigan is a dying state. And the ones to blame are the Michigan elected officials!

"Personal liberty largely consists of the Right of locomotion -- to go where and when one pleases -- only so far restrained as the Rights of others may make it necessary for the welfare of all other citizens. The Right of the Citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon, by horse drawn carriage, wagon, or automobile, is not a mere privilege which may be permitted or prohibited at will, but the common Right which he has under his Right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Under this Constitutional guarantee one may, therefore, under normal conditions, travel at his inclination along the public highways or in public places, and while conducting himself in an orderly and decent manner, neither interfering with nor disturbing another's Rights, he will be protected, not only in his person, but in his safe conduct." [Emphasis added] II Am.Jur. (1st) Constitutional Law, Sect.329, p.1135. (Which means that the State of Michigan Department of Motor Vehicles CANNOT suspend a person driver's license or impose any fines! Only the courts can do that! The State of Michigan CAN NOT AND DOES NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO INTEREFERE WITH ANY PERSONS DRIVER LICENSE THAT IS A PROTECTED PROPERTY INTEREST UNDER THE 14TH AMENDMENT! ONLY THE COURTS CAN TAKE AWAY A PERSONS DRIVERS LICENSE!)So no one has to pay any type of fine or obey Bad Driver fee or can the State of Michigan suspend a persons driver license for not paying a bad driver fee! So drive and if the State of Michigan tries to impose a bad driver fine or suspend a persons driver license for not paying the bad driver fine! YOU SUE THE STATE OF MICHIGAN FOR VIOLATING THE 14th Amendment. NO DUE PROCESS!

Lawyers have a nice racket going with these bad drivers fees. If you plead guilty in a court and then the state sends you a bad driver fee notice. You have the option of going back and retracting you guilty plea in the court. Now! You may have already payed a fine for this traffic ticket in the court, now you got to pay a lawyer to handle your court case again. Only to have to pay the court again for the ticket you payed the court for in the first place! 1) Went to court, payed a fine 2) Payed a bad driver fee to the state 3) Hired lawyer to change your plea 4) The bad driver fee is unconstitutional! 5) Try to find a lawyer who will take this type of case impossible! 6) Why? Its a lawyers bread and butter!Nice scam by lawyers. 7) SO FILE YOUR OWN FEDERAL LAWSUIT PEOPLE! TAKE THE LAW INTO YOUR OWN HANDS BECAUSE NOBODY ELSE IS GOING TO DO IT. And do you think any lawyer is going to fight to change this nice little protection racket they got going? NOT GOING TO HAPPEN!

What is it Michigan voters? Why do you keep electing stupid Republican to office! They are killing us! Majority Leader Mike Bishop Rochester Majority Floor Leader Alan Cropsey DeWitt Jason Allen Traverse City Patty Birkholz Saugatuck Cameron Brown Sturgis Nancy Cassis Novi Valde Garcia Howell Tom George Kalamazoo Jud (BIG ASSHOLE)Gilbert Algonac Bill Hardiman Kentwood Mark Jansen Grand Rapids Ron Jelinek Three Oaks Roger Kahn Saginaw Wayne Kuipers Holland Michelle McManus Lake Leelanau John Pappageorge Troy Bruce Patterson Canton Randy Richardville Monroe Alan Sanborn Richmond Tony Stamas Midland Jerry Van Woerkom Muskegon

Voters! When a Ceo of a company performs badly he/sheis FIRED! Republicans have performed badly while in office! Ruined the State of Michigan! So it is time to FIRE the REPUBLICANS IN OFFICE! VOTE THEM OUT OF OFFICE! Turn Michigan around! Also as far as Presidential Politics. Barack Obama, President and Joe Biden, Vice President. The say Obama doesn't have the experience to be President? Thats were Joe Biden comes in. Biden is experienced. Obama can appoint experienced cabinet memebers to draw on for advice! So Barack Obama for President, and Joe Biden for Vice President...

screw things up and elect SHRILLARY?

Republicans have the "PERFECT TRACK RECORD" for screwing up the United States and the rest of the world!!! Republicans are the dumbest people you will ever meet! A REPUBLICAN is lucky to be able to put two syllables together to form a word! Vote Democrat! Or vote Independent. Just don't vote Republican!!!!!

Put the Republicans out of their misery!!!! VOTE DEMOCRAT!!!!!

Although the Driver Responsibility Act was originally a Republican bill, it is being preserved entirely by Michigan Democrats. When the House Transportation Committee held a hearing on Rep. Scott's bill to reduce (but not repeal) the fees, Rep. Scott said that she would much rather repeal the fees than halve them, but that she had been told by "higher powers" that no repeal bill would ever pass. Now, who is in a position to give orders to House Democrats? Not the voters. Not the NAACP, who testified movingly at the hearing against the fees. Clearly this can only mean the House's Democratic leadership and one other person, and she's a Democrat, too. I predict this fee will not be repealed as long as the Democrats control one house and the governorship. They want the money, and they don't care how they get it. Years from now, the only enduring legacy of the Granholm administration will be the $1,200 traffic ticket, and 100,000 Michigan drivers without driver's licenses.

Republicans have the collective mentallity of a roach! By electing Democrats the only direction the USA can go is UP!!!!! DEMOCRATS ALL THE WAY!!!! REPUBLICANS ARE LOOSER ALL THE WAY!!!

DORK is spelled...R-E-P-U-L-I-C-A-N!!!!!

O'Bama for President!!!! Biden or Edwards for Vice Presisdent!!!!! REPUBLICANS OUT OF THERE LOOSERS!!!!! LOOSERS!!!!! REPUBLICANS A BUNCH OF INBRED LOOSERS!!!

You mis-spelled it, fool!

refer to them as 'dumb-o-crats'.

who is going to vote for shrillary because his union rep says so.

Republicans are going to take a "LICAN" in the next electiAN! DEMOCRATS RULE REPUBLICANS SUCK!!!!

When he left the REPUBLICAN FUND RAISER AT THE CAT HOUSE! LOL!!!!!!!

Who's talking about Hillary? She's not even in this conversation! Barack O'Bama is going to be the next President of the United State! So get used to it!!!!! And it will be either Joe Biden or John Edwards as the Vice President..

even spoken to your union representative about how you should vote yet, have you?

refered to them as "usefull idiots"

Thanks for making chumps out of the people of New York State, Hillary!!! Yep! You came to New York State just so you could launch your stupid run for President. You haven't done one thing for New York State Hillary! Not one! Its been Senator Charles Schumer doing all the work in New York State, not you Clinton. The voters of New York State won't forget you Hillary come elctions time! Hillary get lost!!!! Barack O'Bama for President

obama, not barack o'bama. obama is a muslim name. he 'converted' from muslim to baptist when he ran for politics.

slug, you can't express your support for anyone the union hasn't chosen for you. you need to wait till the liberal media picks it's golden child, which will be shrillary, then, like the good little lock step slug that you are, march off and vote for her, whether you want to or not.

Bill 4006 Repeal DRL, I added it to my legislative watch and never heard if it was repealed? Does anyone know?

and they are obviously in no hurry to repeal it. they have no concern about your rights as they are the one's who violated them in the first place.

Let's start a class action! I'll just need like 250,000 stamps to send a letter to all the class memebers! Federal Court baby!!!

hi my name is carnassis henderson and i live in benton harbor MI and i was trying to get my license and i just turn 17 this month on december 11,2007 and iwas born 1990 and i live at 1017 columbus and i need help tp get my driver license so if you can please help or give me a call thany you.