Michigan Votes Forum

Not all crotch rocket riders in this state are like that. It is just the few idiots that think that they are invincable that give the rest of them the bad reputation. Personally you couldn't give me one of those, I like the cruisers, but to each thier own. RoadTrip.

Anti-American Agenda. That's what AAA really stands for.

The insurance companies take on helmet laws is like Michael Moore's take on President Bush. Half-truths or partial truths totally spun out of proportion. Hopefully our Reps and the Governor can see right through it.

If you are in an accident on a bike you are going to seriously injured or killed helmet or not. Wearing a helmet only increases your chances of becoming a vegatable, which costs a lot of money to keep you alive for no good reason. If you die, it costs nothing.

If you honestly THINK a helmet makes you safer I challenge you to PROVE it. Here's how you can do that. Stand on the side of the highway, put a helmet on, and jump in front of a moving car. If you are willing to do that to prove a helmets safety, then and only then, will I believe they are safer.

That would be a good way to prove a helmets alleged safety, or you could get on a plane, take off your parachute, put a helmet on, and then jump out of the plane. If you survive when you hit the ground, maybe then I'll believe a helmet makes you safer.

Obviously helmets in some situations would be helpful. If you are hit by a stone while riding your bike etc. Don't quote some rhetoric about convertibles I agree. I am just pointing out a logical scenario. As Americans we should be left alone to do whatever we want without Government intrusion. Our forefathers were very vocal about that. Somehow in this country the Government has taught us that their purpose is to take care and protect everyone even from themselves. Thus, pay us and we will make your life wonderful. The helmet repeal is just a baby step towards what the United States Citizen needs to accomplish to get to a constitutionally Limited Republic of which our Forefathers set out to achieve. The helmet law is nothing more than control. Just as income taxes and many many other laws. The issue here is freedom, period.

Would there be a 40% increase in head injuries among non-helmeted riders when a state repeals their helmet law? The answer is NO. According to the Wisconsin Dept. of Transportation it was determined that, in fatal motorcycle accidents there, 28-29% of fatalities were from head injuries. The percentages were the same (within 1/2%) whether the victims were WEARING A HELMET OR NOT. Specifically, in fatal motorcycle accidents where the victim WAS wearing a helmet, 29.4% of those fatalities were from head injuries. By comparison, in fatal accidents where the victim WAS NOT wearing a helmet, 28.9% of the victims died of head injuries. The Governor initiated a requirement to investigate all motorcycle accidents after Wisconsin repealed their helmet law in 1978. This study was suppost to "PROVE" whether or not helmets made a substantial difference in fatalities of helmeted riders v.s. non-helmeted riders. It's 27 years later and Wisconsin STILL allows adults their "choice" on the helmet issue.

1. Helmet laws DO NOT save lives. An analysis of 16 years of NHTSA data from all 50 states clearly shows that the average accident and fatality rate is actually LOWER in helmet choice states. These statistics also prove that a state funded Riders Ed Program prevents more accidents and saves more lives than a mandatory helmet law. A helmet law does NOTHING to prevent the root cause of injuries, which is the accident itself. Even NHTSA states: "Helmets cannot protect the rider form bodily injury which is the #1 cause of motorcycle fatality." 2. Non-helmeted riders ARE NOT a public burden. The conclusion that a helmet law repeal "would put a huge burden on an already-taxed health care system, and the people who support it" is also unfounded, as statistics show that motorcyclists are 3-6% less dependent upon public funds for hospitalzation than the general public. Also, since statistics show the average accident and fatality rate is LOWER in helmet choice states, not being forced to wear a helmet is not a public burden. Moreover, a study by the Highway Safety Research Center and School of Medicine of the University of North Carolina concluded that "there were no significant differences in overall morality, mean trauma scores, mean hospital stays, mean hospital charges, or % of cases discharged to a rehab facility in helmeted and non-helmeted patients, either before or after stratification." 3. Helmet laws ARE COSTING Michigam money and impacting the environment. Helmet laws discourage motorcycle usage, thus increasing statewide fuel consumption (motorcycles get 50-60 mpg), which is an additional burden upon the environment. Amending the helmet law to allow adult helmet choice would have a positive economic impact up to $68 MILLION (using the figures from Florida, which recently amended its helmet law, and adjusting to Michigan's population). This reflects motorcycle sales, sales tax, registration and title fees, etc. In addition, we are losing millions of dollars in tourism revenue because a large number of motorcyclists take their vacations in neighboring states, as none of of our neighbors have an adult helmet law.

The average number of nationwide motorcycle fatalities per year is about 4,000. The average number of nationwide smoking related fatalities per year is about 434,000. That means for every motorcycle fatality there are 108.5 smoking related fatalities. Here's another way to look at it. The number of motorcycle fatalities from now until October of 2113 will equal the number of smoking related fatalities THIS YEAR ALONE! I think we need to get our priorities straight. I'm tired of the health care burden arguement. Motorcyclists are merely a blip on the radar when it comes to health care costs.

MYTH: Injured motorcyclists are uninsured and disproportionately rely on the public to pay for their injuries. FACT: Motorcyclists are just as likely to be privately insured as any other road user. A study done by the University of North Carolina's Highway Safety Research Center reported that 59.5% of injured motorcyclists had their medical costs covered by insurance, while 50.4% of other road trauma victims were similarly insured. The study also showed that motorcyclists were responsible for about $2 million a year in public cost for the entire U.S. as compared to $32 million a year for motor vehicle operators. MYTH: In the five states (Arkansas, Florida, Kentucky, Pennsylvania, and Texas) that have recently weakened their helmet laws, motorcycle fatalities have increased. FACT: In states where helmet laws have been modified to allow adult choice, ridership has increased as much as 75% in the past 5 years. This significant increase in riders may account for the increaes in fatalities. It should not be assumed that the increase in fatalities is a result of the modified law. For example, after Florida's helmet law was modified, the promoters of Daytona Bike Week and Biketoberfest reported an increase in attendence while local officials reported a decrease in accidents and fatalities over the prior year. MYTH: Weakening the helmet law will cause an increase in everyone's insurance rates. FACT: There is ABSOLUTELY NO TRUTH to this statement and no actual figures have been reported by any of the 30 states that allow helmet choice to substantiate the claim that the modification of the existing Michigan law will cost the state millions of dollars. In fact, the costs associated with the treatment of motorcyclists' injuries account for less than 1/10 of 1% of the total U.S. health care costs. (National Center for Health Statistics) In fact one of the primary arguements put forth in California for enacting a mandatory helmet law was that it cause insurance rates to go down. This did not happen, however the revenue garnered by the state for motorcycle registers did go down. MYTH: Riders who do not wear helmets are at a much greater risk of being injured, maimed, or killed. FACT: According to "The American Spectator" an individual is more at risk of injury or death in an American hospital than he or she is if they ride a motorcycle without a helmet. One out of every 100 patients admitted to a hospital is either hurt or dies from medical mistakes. In addition, in 2002, 3,276 motorcyclists lost their lives due to accidents. In that same year: Smoking caused an estimated 434,000 deaths; alcohol, 105,000 deaths; AIDS, 31,000 deaths; fires, 4,000 deaths; and cocaine, crack, heroin and morphine, 6,000 deaths. MYTH: Motorcycle Safety Courses are not effective in decreasing fatalities. FACT: According to the U.S. Dept. of Transportation, motorcycle safety courses are the number one reason for the decline in motorcycle fatalities and injuries. MYTH: Most motorcyclists are irresponsible. FACT: The demographics of the modern day motorcyclist may surprise you. They are as follows: 92% are male, age 35, two thirds are married, most have a high school diploma and some college education, an income range at about 40,000 a year, 95% work in professional, management, and labor careers, and 91% are registered voters. People must know the facts reguarding motorcycle safety. Don't adhere to the rhetoric surrounding this issue. Know the facts. The best way for a motorcyclist to avoid injury is to prevent accidents from happening in the first place. Helmets and helmet laws do not prevent accidents, motorcyclists do. The fact remains that the best way to avoid an accident is through sound rider education safety and motorcycle awareness programs.

Great stats. thanks alot!

Dude how many bikes are you insuring? I have a 1400cc w/ a couple of tickets and pay about 365 a year. And while I am here why is that everyone has to be sarcastic when someone has a difference of opinion? The lady who started this thread seemed to be while not real informed at least sincere. She said if we show her some stats that she would be willing to change her stance didn't she? Isn't that what we're tring to accomplish here? Just help the uninformed if you have an answer that will help the cause and if someone is being a smart... just ignore and or corret them appropriately. Thanks.

Great post! I didn't know about the helmet in a car law, that made me laugh. Cars have seat belts required, we ride bikes and they require helmets but we can't wear them in cars... will it never stop. I heard yesterday that they are toying w/ the idea of airbag vests etc for bikes.

Saying a helmet makes you safer is like saying setting your clock an hour ahead gives you an extra hour of daylight. You don't get an extra hour of daylight, your clock is just an our fast. It's a deception, nothing more. Just like a helmet deceives you into thinking you are safer when you actually are not.

According to Michigan Consultants (Michigan-consultants.com) Michigan is losing $1.2 BILLION (not million, BILLION) a year due to our stupid, useless, outdated, communist helmet law. Wake up Michigan. The time to end the non-sense is NOW! If you won't repeal the law simply because it is the right thing to do, maybe money will lead you to reason.

If only Posthumus had won, Michigan would soon be helmet choice if not already. Right now Jenny from the block is the only obsticle in the way of freedom. Please remember those who support your freedom, those who don't, and excersize your right to vote accordingly. Thank you.

ABATE of Florida has concluded an economic impact study for the first 3 fiscal years of Florida's amended law, and the bottom line reveals that "freedom of choice" has generated over a BILLION dollars into the state's economy from the increase in ridership. From 2000 to 2003 Florida's motorcycle registrations went from 228,914 to 355,007, which represents a 55% increase. The motorcycle registration figures are compiled from the statistics of the Florida Department of Highway Safety and Motor Vehicles. The monetary figures come from the license and registration bureau. 114,457 motorcycles at a low average of $10,000 each = $1,144,570,000 Sales tax on motorcycles at 6% = $68,674,200 Registration fees on motorcycles = $4,578,280 Change of title = $3,406,094 TOTAL = $1,221,228,574 "This is a low estimate as it doesn't include accessories and other items bought", according to James "Doc" Reichenbach II, State President and Lobbyist for ABATE of Florida, and Chairman of the Board for the National Coalition of Motorcyclists (NCOM). "This is over $1.2 BILLION DOLLARS that was put into the economy of the State of Florida." Over 75 MILLION DOLLARS went directly into the state treasury for the general fund. This does not include the tourist money that has increased because of Florida now being a freedom of choice state. In the past 3 years, over 1.3 BILLION DOLLARS has been spent in Florida for Bike Week and Biketoberfest. "I hope this report will help anyone who has heard bad publicity that has come out of our amended law," said Doc. "The motorcyclists have certainly paid their fair share."

30 states allow helmet choice. Therefore logic and common sense CLEARLY show that the insurance companies claims that helmet laws save lives and money are bogus. I only hope you look at this legislation objectlively, not emotionally, and are smart enough to see through the insurance company bull.

Politics is a lot like the justice system. It's not about what's right or wrong, or what's fair or unfair. There is one simple rule: Whoever has the most money, wins. Period. For example, look at the 3 famous murder trials in California; O.J. Simpson; rich celebrity verdict; not guilty Robert Blake; rich celebrity verdict; not guilty Scott Pederson; fertilizer salesman verdict; guilty Simple enough? We all know a "not guilty" verdict doesn't mean you didn't do it, it just means you had enough money to get away with it. Politics are the same way. If it were about right or wrong, there never would have been a helmet law to begin with. But the insurance companies, like Robert Blake and O.J., have enough money to buy whatever they want.

Motorcycle riders killed by person and helmet use 2003 Operators Used helmet 1748 51.7% No Helmet 1527 45.2% Passengers Used helmet 137 49.1% No Helmet 135 48.4% Source: U.S. Department of Transportation, National Highway Traffic Safety Administration

someone asked me if they were to hit me in the head with a bat would I want a helmet on. Good question, and I think a reasonable person would choose to don a helmet under that condition. I would even agree that the helmet might save my life. Unfortunately, that scenario is like a labratory test, a very controlled enviornment. Unfortunately, the conditions of operating a motorcycle in the state of michigan are significantly less controlled and much more hazardous. Maybe the NTSB should perform frontal off set and side impact crash tests for motorcycles. It's not likely that the data would show that a mannikan hitting a brick wall at 35 miles an hour will not sustain life threatening injuries. As for the concerned public and the cost of injuries, is it not less expensive to deal with a death then it is to deal with a severe injury? The focus of laws needs to be on rider education and experience as well as educating all motorists, more stringent testing, more regular testing, stricter operating laws, not laws requiring a helmet that statistically will not save my life in the event of an accident anyway.

Why don't people want to look at these stats? Why do they only focus on the negative?

Two days ago, I get out of work at 1:00. It's a beautiful day, temps in the 70's and not a cloud in the sky. A picture perfect day to get off work early and ride. But unfortunatly I live in Michigan, so I have to head out of state to enjoy my passion. 75 south, exit 210 Alexis rd, the first Ohio exit. I'm sure Michigan riders know it well. I pull up to the gas station (because I sure as heck am not spending my money in Michigan). I pull up to the pump, first thing I do is put my commie cap in the saddlebag. The guy at the pump in front of my has a Michigan plate on his bike. He takes his commie cap out and puts it on. "You must be headed back to Michigan" I say to him. His response, "unfortunately." His bike was one of 52 bikes with Michigan plates I saw while in Ohio (to this day I have yet to see a bike with Ohio plates in Michigan). Keep in mind I was down there between 2 and 5 o'clock on a Tuesday. I go to pay for my gas. I was wearing my HELMET LAWS STINK (stink is not the actual word) T-shirt. The cashier commented on how many bikes with Michigan plates he sees at his station every day, and how our helmet law is good for HIS business. When is Michigan going to get it? Our state is losing millions, if not billions, of dollars each year due to our stupid, restrictive helmet law. Wake up Michigan! Now's the time to amend our stupid, inneffective, costly, useless law.

Wouldn't it be better to not get hit in the head at all than take a hit with a helmet on? This is why riders ed, not legislation, is the better option.

Helmets, and helmet laws DO NOT SAVE LIVES! This is a proven fact. If you disagree, that's fine, YOUR WRONG!

I have to agree with the previous writer. It's safety training -NOT a hazard on your head waiting to happen that will work. I just took a motorcycle accident scene management course and believe me, there are a whole lot of organs in your body. Getting that helmet off was one of the most difficult things we performed- because it is dangerous!

I've never heard anyone refer to a helmet as a commie cap. That's awesome. I'm going to call my helmet a commie cap from now on.

This bill passing the senate is huge. This is the first time in our states history that this bill has passed the senate, and the first time since '80 or '82 that the senate has even voted on it. This bill passed the house in '95, '02, and '04. Each time by a greater margin of victory, therefore I'm confident that it will pass again this year. Now it's up to the Governor that I did not vote for, because of this very reason. This worries me. I've worked too hard for too long to get this far just to have her flush it down the toilet with a veto. If she does that, and next years Gubernatorial race is between her and Nancy(the nazi) Cassis, the SOONEST Michigan could have helmet choice is 2011! I'm not getting any younger, I can't wait that long. Please governor, sign this bill into law. Although I did not vote for you last time, I absolutely will this time if you sign this bill. My future as a Michigan resident and business owner will ultimately be decided by the outcome of this legislation. If this bill gets vetoed, I'm moving my family and my business to Arizona. With unemployment being as high as it is in Michigan, the last thing this state needs is to lose more jobs. I would hate to do that, but I feel that passionately about this legislation. Please, let's finally get this done.

Not only would our state's economy benefit greatly by allowing helmet choice due to increased motorcycle sales and tourism dollars, but apparently we have business owners who are willing to leave Michigan because of our law. I say we do the right thing and allow freedom of choice.

If Jenny vetos this bill her reason will most likely be safety. Keep in mind she also cut funding for the Riders Ed program, which is proven to be a far greater method of motorcycle safety than a helmet or helmet law. The insurance companies, who are constantly crying about safety, also do not support the Riders Ed program. It seems to me that safety is not really the issue. This is nothing more than discrimination.

It's pretty obvious that the Governor doesn't care about motorcycle safety since she cut the funding for the safety course. Indiana has allowed helmet choice since ' 76, their safety course did not begin until ' 79. Since then motorcycle accidents and fatalities have dropped 65%. Thus proving that rider education and driver awareness are far better at saving lives than any helmet or helmet law.

You should mail this story to your reps and to the gov. Makes sense to me.

Michigan is one of the worst places in the nation to find a job right now. Going helmetless would generate billons of dollars. Safety courses are proven more effective then helmets in the savings of lives which is what all the nays harp on, yet she wants to veto repeal and cut money on rider education. What is she thinking? I read there are 487,000 motorcycle endorsements in this state. Taking away those not registered that still has to be at least 250,000 votes. Abate has been fighting this battle 40 odd years do they think we are going away? Well if she veto's all I can say... or really do is not vote for her. It's just like the 70mph on highways, they thought if it was raised that death rates would spike up and it never occurred. They discussed the concealed handgun law and thought there would be a shootout on every corner that didn't happen either. Why don't they just repeal the law and do a 3 year study and if they can prove that the number of bikes registered in that time and the number of deaths are not in proportion then they can enact another helmet law. I too am way tired of waiting.

The skyrocketing crime rate that was supposed to happen when the Casinos were built. RoadTrip

Can anyone explain why the bill was only in the Senate for 7 days from committee referral to passing, and this one has been in committee in the House for a month now? When is it going to be voted on? I sure hope they aren't just going to leave it there and forget about it.

The day the bill passed the senate the Canadien commie that the idiots of this state voted to be our Governor said she would veto the bill if it got to her desk. Therefore there is no reason to vote it through the house until we are sure she will sign it, or at the very least not veto it. This, I fear, probably will not happen. She doesn't seem to be on our side. The best thing you can do is write her a letter telling her you are a registered voter who wants to see this bill passed. Here is how to contact her; Governor Jennifer Granholm State Capitol P.O. Box 30013 Lansing, Mi. 48909

82 degrees and sunny. To bad Michigan still has a helmet law. I, along with many other Michigan bikers, rode helmet free in Ohio. Just another day spending my money out of state, and another day of no one from out of state spending money here. Hopefully someday Michigan will get it.

For those who do not know, here is a brief history lesson; When WW2 came to an end the birth of the "rebel biker" began. During the 50's and 60's these "outlaws on wheels" terrorized towns, ran narcotics, and were basically a menace to society. In 1966 the Federal Government decided to create a helmet law. Not to save the lives of outlaws, but rather to discourage riding. The law was written to let the individual state decide weather nor not to enact a helmet law, however those that did not comply would be punished by not receiving federal highway money. By 1969 only California (California now has a helmet law) and Illinois still allowed helmet choice. Michigan followed a national trend along with the 47 other states. In the early 70's, bikers decided to work together and fight the government instead of themselves to change the law. In 1975 the Federal Government lifted the highway money ban, and still to this day no longer exists. Between 1976 and 1982 20 states, including all that border Michigan, repealed their helmet law. A national trend that Michigan unfortunatly did not follow. From 1982 to 1996 that's pretty much how it stayed. In 1997 Texas and Arkansas repealed their helmet laws. Since then 8 other states have repealed their laws, bringing the total of helmet choice states to 30. Hopefully this time Michigan will follow the national trend and allow adult helmet choice as we are now in the minority on this issue. It sure would be nice, we are long overdue. My point is that every helmet choice state other than Illinois has had to fight for their freedom. Please don't give up.

What motivated the national trend to have a helmet law back in the late 60's was money. It would have been taken away if a helmet law was not enacted. Now that the national trend has gone the other way I have got to believe that the motivation is still money. Let's get serious, the politicians aren't going to repeal the law unless there is money to be made. When Florida repealed their law 5 years ago that states economy has benefited greatly from increased motorcycle sales and tourism. $750 MILLION in the first year alone. Michigan could use any and all the economic help it can get. I say we do it. Not only for the money, but because it's the right thing to do.